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  1. zerohaste's Avatar
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    #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by Weaser999 View Post
    At 1024x768 i'm pretty sure 256K colors will suffice. Now if it were 1920x1200 that would be a different story. I think it boils down to the ratio between resolution and colors. 24 bit color may just be overkill on a smaller resolution screen. The difference however between 16-bit like many android phones use, and 18 bit is huge.
    It probably wouldn't be too big a deal if the Pre minus Pre 2 and Pre 3 didn't have 24-bit displays.

    There's no excuse for it, to be honest. This is supposed to be a flagship device that sells for the same prices as the iPad 2. They shouldn't be skimping on the specs.
  2. #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by nightdevil21 View Post
    so is this a software modification that changes the color depth? or hardware? Like they could make it an option right? in the settings?
    It's hardware.

    If the dithering method wasn't up to par, people who have seen the in person demos would have been able to notice it. IIRC, Apple was sued a few years ago for selling machines with 18bit displays but were being marketed as having 24bit.
  3.    #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by zerohaste View Post
    It probably wouldn't be too big a deal if the Pre minus Pre 2 and Pre 3 didn't have 24-bit displays.

    There's no excuse for it, to be honest. This is supposed to be a flagship device that sells for the same prices as the iPad 2. They shouldn't be skimping on the specs.
    I think this was a big part of my concern (besides being a spec-head & able to see the difference between 18/24 bit) this is going to be perceived as HP going backwards on product capability at a time when they REALLY need to be perceived as pushing the tech forward, or at least have parity with competing products.

    The iPad (the only comparison that really matters) has a 24 bit display. Most, if not all, current Android tablets have 24 bit displays. How can HP justify going 18 bit? Sure it'll have better graphics performance, but isn't that why we've got that hot dual-core processor and speedy GPU?

    I think the only spin that seems to apply here is HP was trying to cut costs and that doesn't sound good at all on the eve of the flagship's release.
  4. Thead's Avatar
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    #44  
    Maybe this is just another reason why people should actually test what they're buying before they buy it? We haven't heard any reports yet from anyone who has actually played with the device that there was anything wrong with the colors. I know we're all excited about the release of the first webos tablet, but this kind of stuff happens all the time with gadgets, both for the good and the bad. Look at all the android phones that everyone swoons over because of their amazing specs then a few weeks in everyone realizes the battery life is horrendous. While this sounds bad in theory, I bet if most of the people claiming this is a potential dealbreaker actually played with a touchpad they would say the screen looked fine.
  5. #45  
    I think the optional swipe down (with slingshot stretching sound effects) to close an app more than makes up for only having 18bit color depth.

    On a more serious note, spec wise I wish it had 24 bit, but I will reserve judgment (if 18bit is bad as some believe) until I have actually played with one in person.

    EDIT: My stupid computer at work can only do 16bit/32bit, so no option to set it to 18bit and open up some pics
  6. #46  
    Quote Originally Posted by Thead View Post
    Maybe this is just another reason why people should actually test what they're buying before they buy it?
    very true. Its very expensive and people really should wait for the reviews and get some hands on in stores before shelling out that much money.
  7.    #47  
    I don't necessarily think it's a deal breaker, just a surprise. I don't remember seeing anyone talk about it before.

    This is one of the reasons I didn't pre-order so I can go hands on in the store. I'm also hoping to see how pReader works on it.
  8. #48  
    for the record, even if your LCD is 18 bit, you can likely change the settings to 32 bit and the OS will dither the results out.
  9. #49  
    @agentmock

    Audiovox SMT5600 (WM) --> Cingular 8125 (WM) --> Sprint Mogul 8525 (WM) --> Palm Pre (webOS)- --> Sprint Franken Pre2 (webOS) + 32gb Touchpad (webOS)
  10. #50  
    The bottom line will be if there is ANY banding eveident or not.. the spec is less important that the actual appearance... so far, we've not heard a single complaint about the display - in fact, we HVE heard that the display was sharp and smooth, even when 3D gaming...

    So, its just a matter of time to see, now.
    "The more I learn, the more I realize just how little I really do know!" -Albert Einstein

  11. #51  
    It's that superb Apple marketing machine in action again! The truth is that the native LCD displays are all 18 bit - even though Apple claim otherwise.

    The 24bit capability effect can be(dithering) achieved by 'maniputlating' adjacent pixels to provide a smooth blend of colour transition - to do this properly takes graphics horsepower - Apple may have achieved it but I smomehow doubt with a claimed 10 hour battery life.

    HP marketing are being brutally honest (they have strong corporate governance for this kind of thing).

    Don't beat HP up - they aren't short changing us at all - just telling it like it is. I'd be willing to bet that an iPad2 and Touchpad side by side with the same image source and brightness would be identical.
  12. #52  
    LOL. Here we are again blaming everything on Apple marketing.
  13. #53  
    Just read below:
    List of monochrome and RGB palettes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    This is a pretty simple explanation of color palettes. The truth is if you received your LCD monitor for free with the computer or bought a cheaper model you have an 18-bit monitor and won't be able to tell a difference between 18-bit and 24-bit.
  14. #54  
    Not too sure when this was written and/or if it still holds true, but...

    LCD Color
    8-Bit vs. 6-Bit
    By Mark Kyrnin, About.com Guide

    The color range of a computer is defined by the term color depth. This means the total number of colors that the computer and display, in tandem, can display to the user. The most common color depths that users will see when dealing with a PCs are 8-bit (256 colors), 16-bit (65,536 colors) and 24-bit (16.7 million colors). True color (or 24-bit color) is the most frequently used mode now as computers have attained sufficient levels to easily work at this color depth. Some professional use a 32-bit color depth, but this is mainly used as a means to pad the color to get more defined tones when rendered down to the 24-bit level.

    Speed Versus Color

    LCD monitors have encountered a bit of a problem when it comes to dealing with color and speed. Color on an LCD is comprised of three layers of colored dots that make up the final pixel. To display a given color, current must be applied to each color layer to give the desired intensity that generates the final color. The problem is that to get the colors, the current must move the crystals on and off to the desired intensity levels. This transition from the on to off state is called the response time. For most screens this was rated around 25ms.

    The problem is that many LCD monitors are used to watch video or motion on the screen. With this 25ms time frame for transition from on to on states, pixels that should have transitioned to the new color levels trail the signal and result in an effect know as motion blurring. This isn't a problem if the monitor is being used with applications such as productivity software, but with video and motion it can be jarring.

    Since consumers were demanding faster screens, something needed to be done to improve response times. To facilitate this, many manufacturers turned to reducing the number of levels each color pixel render. This reduction in the number of intensity levels allows the response times to drop but has the drawback of reducing the overall number of colors that can be rendered.

    8-Bit vs. 6-Bit

    Now color depth was previous referred to by the total number of colors that the screen can render, but when referring to LCD panels the number of levels that each color can render is used instead. This can make things difficult to understand, but to demonstrate, we will look at the mathematics of it. For example, 24-bit or true color is comprised of three colors each with 8-bits of color. Mathematically, this is represented as:

    •2^8 x 2^8 x 2^8 = 256 x 256 x 256 = 16,777,216
    High-speed LCD monitors typically reduce the number of bits for each color to 6 instead of the standard 8. This 6-bit color will generate far fewer colors than 8-bit as we see when we do the math:

    •2^6 x 2^6 x 2^6 = 64 x 64 x 64 = 262,144
    This is far fewer than the true color display such that it would be noticeable to the human eye. To get around this problem, the manufacturers employ a technique referred to as dithering. This is an effect where nearby pixels use slightly varying shades or color that trick the human eye into perceiving the desired color even though it isn't truly that color. A color newspaper photo is a good way to see this effect in practice. (In print the effect is called half-tones.) By using this technique, the manufacturers claim to achieve a color depth close to that of the true color displays.

    How to Tell if an LCD is 8-Bit or 6-Bit

    This is the biggest problem for individuals who are looking at purchasing an LCD monitor. Most manufacturers do not list the color depth of their display. Even fewer will list the actual per-color depth. If the manufacturer lists the color as 16.7 million colors, it should be assumed that the display is 8-bit per-color. If the colors are listed as being 16.2 million or 16 million, consumers should assume that it uses a 6-bit per-color depth. If no color depths is listed, it should be assumed that monitors of 12ms or faster will be 6-bit and the 20ms and slower panels are 8-bit.

    Does it Really Matter?

    This is very subjective to the actual user and what the computer is used for. The amount of color really matters to those that do professional work on graphics. For these people, the amount of color that is displayed on the screen is very important. The average consumer is not going to really need this level of color representation by their monitor. As a result, it probably doesn't matter. People using their displays for video games or watching video will likely not care about the number of colors rendered by the LCD but by the speed at which it can be displayed. As a result, it is best to determine your needs and base your purchase on those criteria.
    So I guess they are saying you can simulate 16.2 million colors with 18bit?

    Source: LCD Color: 8-Bit vs. 6-Bit

    EDIT: After reading that article, I feel much better about 18bit color on the TouchPad.
    Last edited by sinime; 06/23/2011 at 10:19 AM.
  15. #55  
    Quote Originally Posted by passlogix View Post
    LOL. Here we are again blaming everything on Apple marketing.
    I love Apple marketing - it is simply the best in any industry vertical I can think of - maximum respect.
  16. #56  
    So care about 18bit or 24bit. So far all the review seems to be quite positive. I hope webOS does well on TouchPad. I will be buying TouchPad 2 if TP does indeed bring alot of attention to the big name developer. However, TouchPad 2 better have better resolution, hdmi and all the stuffs that were missing on TouchPad 1.
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