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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by deesugar View Post
    Yeah but that's stealing bandwidth that you haven't paid for. I can understand that. Just like Sprint could ask FreeTether to stop and they'd be in the right to do so.

    But transferring calls and texts is no different then my car's hands free device which if Apple blocked would probably start a legal battle that they couldn't win.
    Its slightly different, but you get my point. Like limiting facetime to wifi... preventing it from working with it's own 3g radio. Or letting me play songs I bought in iTunes on another brand of mp3 player, etc. Apple doesn't allow that stuff in every area you can think of. They actively undo jailbreaking, etc...

    I'm sure someone will pipe in with other examples because I haven't messed with iOS lately.

    But the point is that there isn't any limits being imposed by HP...
    Last edited by Cantaffordit; 04/07/2011 at 04:03 PM.
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by MilenkoD View Post
    So how does an app like Bump share data between and Android and iOS device? Apple has allowed that app knowing it's interopperable between platforms. They've set a precedence there...would be hard for them to decline it provided it's made to work with other iOS devices also.
    I don't know how that works, but it's certainly not using the 3G radio in one to make calls on the other... It would be like writing an android app that allowed a Xoom or Galaxy Tab to make facetime calls through the iPhone, or even place wireless calls using the iPhone radio. If someone figured out how to do it with an android app, Apple would release an "update" to iOS to shut it down.
  3. #23  
    Ah, here it is. Bump2share is actually transmitting data over the internet and passing it through a cloud server that Bump operates:

    Q: How does Bump work?
    A: There are two parts to Bump: the app running on your device and a smart matching algorithm running on our servers in the cloud. The app on your phone uses the phone's sensors to literally "feel" the bump, and it sends that info up to the cloud. The matching algorithm listens to the bumps from phones around the world and pairs up phones that felt the same bump. Then we just route information between the two phones in each pair.
  4. #24  
    I think its definitely different than the tethering scenario (your phone is still fielding the phone call; still being charged for minutes/texts).

    And i also agree, that an android app would have a much better chance of getting legally installed than an iOS app. That still is a tremendous number of users you just opened up your product to. Additionally, make the app and submit it to the apple app store. Let them explain to their consumers why they won't let the consumer purchase the app.
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by MilenkoD View Post
    ...I agree/disagree...RIM is making a bigger mistake.
    The sharing of the phone and messaging capabilities of the Pre3 and Touchpad are a BONUS HP is giving to owners of both, without the phone the touchpad works the same way as the ipad and every other android tablet out there. So no mistake just more awesomeness if you own 2 (or more) webOS devices

    RIM on the other hand is actually forcing you to use a blackberry for core functionality of the playbook.

    Edit: Do you also want HP to allow android makers and apple touch to share for the same reason that not everyone is going to own 2 webos devices?
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by MilenkoD View Post
    Herein lies the path to possible failure (or less success). They are relying on something proprietary in hardware. A misstep.
    The problem with that is if they didn't rely on specially created hardware to do the job, the whole think would be done through bluetooth. And that would reek havok. That would be a failure of execution.
    Another thing is that the people who buy the TouchPad are the people who are going to want a Pre3 or Veer anyway. Yes, there will be a number of people with only the TouchPad but I personally think that most people who but the TouchPad aren't buying the 'combo'. They 'have to get' the Pre3 and then buying the TouchPad.
    "Life is Hard... it's harder if your stupid"
    - John Wayne
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by MilenkoD View Post
    Is HP making a mistake by reserving thier best/unique features to work amongst their own ecosystem?

    As I understand it TouchPad features such as phone calls, SMS and Touch To Share are only possible via another webOS device (Pre 3 for now). All cool features that are needed to differentiate the TouchPad in the tablet market. But why limit to the Pre only?

    Very few are going to buy the TouchPad and Pre3 combo....there will be sales but not to the tune of "The HP Scale" mantra. People like their smartphones and are most likely already tied down on contracts. Many consumers out there buy what they believe are best-in-class or best-price devices. Why not let an iOS, Andriod, RIM device (whatever they might percieve as best-in-class/price for them) and let it pair with the TouchPad to use these differntiating features? It looks like a mistake that'll make the TouchPad "just another tablet" without the Pre. The Pre 3 or the TouchPad alone don't really compell me to buy it over the iPad Playbook or Android-whatever without these features. What does it have going for it otherwise than a "me too" iPad? Maybe there's a "one more thing" going to be pulled out of the HP hat...but I doubt it.

    What do you people think?
    TTS is a nice little feature - but it's not *that* big a deal. I don't see many people buying it *just* or mostly for that.

    And the people with IPhones are *not* the primary target market. They are already invested in ITunes, might already have an IPad (and IPod, etc...).

    This is a fast growing market where the majority of mobile phone users are still using "dumb" phones.

    For HP to quickly grow market share they need to get either the many fresh entries into the market who get their first smartphone - or those who have a random Android, Blackberry phone - but not too invested in its apps.

    And amongst those, sure HP will sell a lot of combos of Pre3 (or Veer or Pre2 or whatever smartphone) and Touchpads. Who in their right minds want to buy into 2 mobile app markets when 1 is enough (and saves you money).

    At the end of the day HP wants to be the other Apple. Apple is the only company with a fully integrated ecosystem of hard- and software.
    HP wants that too - and atm they are the only other company with the proper building blocks to get there (MS would love to get there too I'm sure, Blackberry is doomed IMHO). That's why they bought all those companies recently.

    In such an ecosystem when you get customers to buy into a couple of your products (e.g. IPod, ITunes) they get added value from buying even more of your stuff (e.g. IPhones, apps, accesories, Macbook, etc...).

    So here is the plan:
    You already have an HP printer and perhaps a HP PC or Laptop. Now here comes the Touchpad or Pre3 and suddenly you find that their is a webos environment coming in with a HP desktop upgrade that gives you some convenience features. And your HP printer appears on your Touchpad automagically. And you don't remember configuring anything on your Pre but it lists your wifi printer as an option for printout.

    Then you buy some apps and you get told that for best sound quality and no hassles you should get that Beats Audio Headphones and Speakers and they are already in your Laptop. And here is a coupon for valued customers with 10% rebate.
    And here is your HP Cloud Storage. 5GB for free - would you like some more for a low monthly rate for all your backup needs? Total Synergy included of course. Premium features available for corporate customers.

    It will be mostly about integrated ecosystems in the future.

    What you consider a mistake - Apple and now HP see as the game plan. It's their whole strategy. Sure - the devices will talk to the outside world via Bluetooth and internet. Standard protocols will be supported - mostly. But there will always be something extra when you buy consistently from the one true brand.

    In short - businesses are in the business of making money. They want our money. And as soon as they have us as customers for anything they love the idea of making us repeat customers for a lot of things.
    Pre -> Pre3 & TP32 -> Nexus 5
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by MilenkoD View Post
    Is HP making a mistake by reserving thier best/unique features to work amongst their own ecosystem?

    As I understand it TouchPad features such as phone calls, SMS and Touch To Share are only possible via another webOS device (Pre 3 for now). All cool features that are needed to differentiate the TouchPad in the tablet market. But why limit to the Pre only?

    Very few are going to buy the TouchPad and Pre3 combo....there will be sales but not to the tune of "The HP Scale" mantra. People like their smartphones and are most likely already tied down on contracts. Many consumers out there buy what they believe are best-in-class or best-price devices. Why not let an iOS, Andriod, RIM device (whatever they might percieve as best-in-class/price for them) and let it pair with the TouchPad to use these differntiating features? It looks like a mistake that'll make the TouchPad "just another tablet" without the Pre. The Pre 3 or the TouchPad alone don't really compell me to buy it over the iPad Playbook or Android-whatever without these features. What does it have going for it otherwise than a "me too" iPad? Maybe there's a "one more thing" going to be pulled out of the HP hat...but I doubt it.

    What do you people think?
    It's not a bad idea at all, really, to make people who buy the TouchPad want to buy a Pre 3 or Veer (or other WebOS devices). This does make it more important to have choices on every carrier (major ones, at least). Because I won't buy a TouchPad if I can't buy a Pre 3 (or WebOS device) on Sprint. And people prob wont change carriers just to use that feature.

    But they would go out and buy a phone thats on their carrier so they can use the features that are really amazing. Think about it: how many times have you missed a call b/c your phone is in the other room charging? More then likely, unless it's charging, my TouchPad will be in the living room chillin'. So when I get a call, or a text, and it forwards to my TP -- I'll get the memo and won't miss my call/text. Which is pretty cool if you ask me!
  9. #29  
    just look at android and how fast it has grown in market share. The Veer, Pre3 and TouchPad alone are not going to do much for growth of WebOS marketshare. A little, but not much and I could see WebOS devices being a niche market solution and not mainstream. I really think it is too late to the game and it will be 5th in market share for a very long time.

    Opening WebOS up so other phone manufactures would help explode the growth - a la Android.

    Think about it - Android, iOS, Windows, RIM are pretty much established; HP has basically said the launch of WebOS 3.0 is basically a new launch of the OS and the current install base is not even something they think about.
  10. #30  
    people have to keep in mind that HP isn't looking for instant growth. No. They have a long term strategy and plan.

    webOS was built to last for the future. Soon iOS and Android will reach their limits eventually.
  11. #31  
    So...just so I understand correctly

    Apple software / hardware combination proprietary = Genius
    HP software / hardware combination proprietary = Mistake
    Ex HP webOS Tech Support

    5Ts: Five ways to get your webOS tablet working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/5Ts

    6Ts: Six ways to get your webOS phone working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/6Ts
  12. #32  
    In regards to receiving and making calls on the TouchPad, and if it is limited to only the Pre 3 and Veer, is to use the upcoming Google Voice feature by Sprint (if you are on Sprint). They are going to allow you to use your Sprint number as the primary number for google voice for free. Get a TouchPad, use your Sprint number in Google Voice, and then set it up so that calls ring on your current cell phone, home phone, work phone, computer, and TouchPad. Problem solved. You just don't get to use the cool touchstone technology.
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by HardBeatZ View Post
    So...just so I understand correctly

    Apple software / hardware combination proprietary = Genius
    HP software / hardware combination proprietary = Mistake
    Yeah I think you nailed the logic(or lack of) perfectly.
  14. #34  
    How can you expect 2 different companies with different platforms with different ideas do the same thing? Logically it would be a miracle if the 2 would not purposefully try to nerf the other. Making a feature to support a competitor and pray they will vest resources to do their part is bad business.
    Try diplomacy first. You can always conquer them later...

    www.webos-internals.org, read it, use it, love it, and donate to it.....
  15. #35  
    Are you saying you don't pay for your bandwidth? Why exactly would sprint be right about stopping freetether if they chose to? Do you utilize more than one web device from home? If so, do you have more than one ISP account to accommodate your other hardware? Do you think wireless routers are somehow about 'stealing' bandwidth you didn't pay for?

    Following your definitions, you'd have to consider call transfers to bluetooth as 'stealing' bandwidth you somehow haven't paid for.
  16. #36  
    I agree with you 100%

    10 years ago, apple was a joke to most in the industry. Not so for those in graphic design and video editing. Now they're a force to be reckoned with.

    Today, Palm is much like Apple was ten years ago. HP buying Palm saved it from utter death. Lets hope the Palm legacy follows as a force in the future.

    If you look at Apple with a historical perspective, their leadership as a trend setter isn't set in stone and will see an end. They'll always be around, but they'll find themselves in a niche market again.

    MS used to be a dominant force in everything they did, and look at them now. Everyone has their time.

    Quote Originally Posted by HardBeatZ View Post
    So...just so I understand correctly

    Apple software / hardware combination proprietary = Genius
    HP software / hardware combination proprietary = Mistake
  17.    #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by HardBeatZ View Post
    So...just so I understand correctly

    Apple software / hardware combination proprietary = Genius
    HP software / hardware combination proprietary = Mistake
    More like:

    HP copying last year's devices and not making anything compelling = Mistake.
  18. #38  
    I'm not in the market for a tablet. That said, hardware limitations or not, to me it still boils down to a basic question of "Why should i buy a touchpad or xoom or playbook over an ipad 2?" I still don't know the answer to that.
  19. ijip's Avatar
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    #39  
    its about the ecosystem buddy... wat will seperate the touchpad from other system is the way their sytem works together.... it may be a longer road to grind but when more people start to take advatange of it the growth potential is much much higher~!
    Want to help design and write an app?
    follow me at Twiiter @ijip
    THANKS~!!
  20. #40  
    If that's their sales pitch i think they are in for a rocky road. it strikes me just as corporate speak. Doesn't really make the case for my mind to the non techy consumer with no allegiance to any company. They can say "ecosystem" all they want but it's not like ipad 2 doesn't have a better one right now. I doubt right now that would make the case. But that's just my opinion. maybe most other consumers would find it compelling.
    Last edited by blackmagic01; 04/09/2011 at 07:03 PM.
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