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  1. #21  
    Apple has 350K iphone apps that work on IP, and 65K apps specific to IP. There must be a reason, why they are not using just a browser.
    If this helped you hit thanks.
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    I don't understand your point? Flash is pretty crappy on mobile, so how would it help me as an android user (which flash is sorta available for but is completely awful) who is using the Farmer Insurance on my android device. Why would I perfer to use a browser on my phone than a custom designed android app?
    I think he was trying to say you should just be able to go into your account through the browser instead of using an app, therefore the apps are useless marketing. I agree with you though, that mobile optimized apps are better. They run faster and lighter. Waiting for pages to load up in the browser and then hope the site can even be looked at properly in your browser, even if an HTML browser(because some sites still look and navigate better on a desktop), eh yeah... Sometimes that works and sometimes it doesn't.

    BTW though, the Farmers desktop site seems to be javascript, not Flash. Not too bad for most modern browsers. That one you may be able to use in the browser. It works on iOS.
    Last edited by The Phone Diva; 03/04/2011 at 12:52 PM.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by cobrakon View Post
    How do you access Farmer's Insurance from your house? Computer+Browser? And there in lies the rub (and the evil plot) of "i-devices". Because sir Jobs refutes flash, NORMAL websites that would be commonly used now have..."apps" to allow the i-masses to access a site that their precious device cannot see natively. 40% of the internet is a lot of missing content...



    But I digress...
    however, with my kid driving now - If I can get the police to pull up right in an app - like they do for android and apple, life would be a bit better. just saying.
  4. #24  
    Folks, the leading mobile apps - Twitter and Facebook excepted - are not simple aggregators of website content.

    Check the iTunes charts at Apple.com. 8 of the top 10 paid are games. 9 of the top 10 free are games (one is VLC media player).

    Android is the exact same. With the aforementioned exceptions, none of the top 12 free or paid apps are aggregated websites.

    These platforms have depth in each category, and if you look deeper, the same pattern holds, for the most part.

    Even if you believed the argument that you need nothing more than a browser for a tablet, you're going to need more than mobile flash and the standard, non-tabbing WebOS browser, don't you think?
  5. #25  
    For what I'd use it for, the big apps would be: email, facebook, the browser, and maybe forums. Having browser tabs would be nice, but isn't a big deal for me. The ebook readers that have been announced would be ok too.
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by hrminer92 View Post
    For what I'd use it for, the big apps would be: email, facebook, the browser, and maybe forums. Having browser tabs would be nice, but isn't a big deal for me. The ebook readers that have been announced would be ok too.
    I see no reason why you wouldn't get a refurbished iPad I, then. Mobile Safari has swipeable cards for all of your Web pages. MyPad will probably give you a better tablet-optimized Facebook experience than WebOS ever will. Email is great. If you don't like the obtrusive notifications, jailbreak it and install Mobile Notifier from Cydia.

    $350. Available until Apple runs through their current stock.
  7. #27  
    @Mikah912 I understand and agree with the long tail portion of your argument however going by the chart you referenced it seems the only thing people are buying these tablets for is gaming.

    Majority of what most people use a desktop for is web browsing and email. Both of these can be accomplished by any tablet. I would suggest that with (on demand) flash support Android and webOS devices are better as they can access the full web.

    Apple wants to sell people on the idea of an app for every site and they are succeeding however that is a very short term solution. They are trying to change the mindset of users. How soon will we feel ok to pay for an app to access content on the web available freely otherwise . It has already started, case in point, I have several apps that are nothing but web portals with better navigation that I paid for. An app for a web site is not an answer to the problem. This is easily accomplished by having/creating a good mobile website which will work with ANY device. Precentral, engadget and webOSroundup all look great on mobile versions (I would argue they are better than their respective apps (except precentral which doesn't have one). However, having a paid app allows these companies to make money (along with apple) so every one is onboard.

    As for games, iDevices need apps because they don't support flash, how many of these games are ports of freely available flash games? and before I hear "not every game is a flash game" let me state in advance "I agree infinity blade is not a flash game " and that there are several dozens of games that are not flash based. But still the majority of the games has roots in flash.

    For me it comes down to actual experience with the device. iOS on every device is a very restrictive experience. You really need to jailbreak to get the most out of it. That said , my experience with jailbreak/homebrew has been frustrating to say the least as it is a pain to constantly keep updating your device.

    WebOS on a phone has shown me that this operating system is much more akin to a full desktop OS than iOS is to OSX. It was and still is a pleasure to use. Speed issues aside it works wonderfully. Since downloaded stuff is available to every app it has been less of a hassle to use. My media stuff downloaded to any folder is accessible and visible in the relevant apps (music in the music players, pictures in the picture apps, video in the video player etc.). OTA updates and ability to just use my device as a usb disk has been awesome. If they continue to do this with webOS 3.0 then they definitely will have a chance in the market.

    Coming back to the question by OP, people keep saying touchpad has no apps because the SDK is still in alpha (not beta). While it can run all mojo apps they will be run in a windowed environment since touchpad does not have physical gesture area. Why they couldn't assign the last 20 pixels (vertically) to be a gesture area or notification+buttons area a la honeycomb is a topic for another thread.

    Apple, when it announced iPad had said that it was compatible with every app that did not require phone or camera but they were focusing on native iPAD apps more (seeing how ugly iphone text apps look I can't blame them ) . They had launched with 5000 apps specifically designed for iPad (all of which were iPhone variants designed to use the bigger screen and higher resolution). This was helped by the fact that Apple had made the final SDK available in January along with the announcement of iPad and iPad was released 3 months later. Also, iPad literally is a giant ipod touch with no other changes (other than resolution) so the SDK was easier to port to iPad.

    Touchpad or Honeycomb are not really a giant PRE or galaxy S device. The competitors are late to market as they are trying to differentiate themselves from Apple but it will cost them in the near term. Neither software nor hardware is ready where as Apple already had 3 years of software AND hardware experience (a look at the innards of iPad shows a circuit board designed to fit into a phone and a battery everywhere else).

    Apple looks to be holding on to its Monopoly on the "internet tablet" market space for the near future. I think this time next year will be very interesting.
  8. cgk
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    #28  
    Apple looks to be holding on to its Monopoly on the "internet tablet" market space for the near future. I think this time next year will be very interesting.
    I agree with you - I think the 2011 battle is already over unless the Touchpad or similar are launched for $200 or less, even then I don't see much of a dent being made. I think the question of "can someone produce a more compelling tablet experience than Apple?" is now one for 2012.
  9. #29  
    I love how the 'use the browser' crowd ignores the apps that come with the device. Why do you use the mail app or the calendar app or the contact app when you can just go to the browser?

    Face it: no matter how good a browser is, the experience of using an app that is created for your device is superior 9/10 times.
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    I see no reason why you wouldn't get a refurbished iPad I, then. Mobile Safari has swipeable cards for all of your Web pages. MyPad will probably give you a better tablet-optimized Facebook experience than WebOS ever will. Email is great. If you don't like the obtrusive notifications, jailbreak it and install Mobile Notifier from Cydia.

    $350. Available until Apple runs through their current stock.
    No thank you.

    I've played with an iPad on several occasions. I don't like the way it works, so I'm not going to be in the market for one no matter what the price. I prefer the webOS version of facebook to the normal browser version too.
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by pavvento View Post
    I love how the 'use the browser' crowd ignores the apps that come with the device. Why do you use the mail app or the calendar app or the contact app when you can just go to the browser?

    Face it: no matter how good a browser is, the experience of using an app that is created for your device is superior 9/10 times.
    Those are essential apps that are 100% expected to come with every tablet. That is why no one is talking about them. Even samsung galaxy tab had a redesigned email and calendar app.

    A little off-topic, that is why I think Blackberry needs to clarify its position on *no native apps without a blackberry phone integration, otherwise it is going to be DOA.

    *Gizmodo, the Gadget Guide
  12. #32  
    What's there to clarify? You need a BlackBerry to use the calendar and email on the PlayBook. It's their way of considerately making sure this thing is DOA.
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by hrminer92 View Post
    No thank you.

    I've played with an iPad on several occasions. I don't like the way it works, so I'm not going to be in the market for one no matter what the price. I prefer the webOS version of facebook to the normal browser version too.
    You don't think there might be a few diferences between WebOS on a device with a gesture area, hardware keyboard, and mini cards versus a slab with no gesture area, no keyboard, and a comparatively huge amount of real estate to fill?
  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by sapient2k7 View Post
    Those are essential apps that are 100% expected to come with every tablet. That is why no one is talking about them. Even samsung galaxy tab had a redesigned email and calendar app.

    A little off-topic, that is why I think Blackberry needs to clarify its position on *no native apps without a blackberry phone integration, otherwise it is going to be DOA.

    *Gizmodo, the Gadget Guide
    What's essential is relative to the user. For some having a photo app that views photos is essential, for others a full photo editor is essential. The fact remains that for many tasks a well developed app is more desirable than a webpage.

    Additionally, we can argue all we want about the value of apps, but the average consumer wants them and sees them as important in choosing a product. There is no way the TouchPad sells without support of major apps.

    We love webOS for how it does things, but people will ask 'what does' it do.
    Last edited by pavvento; 03/04/2011 at 03:47 PM.
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    You don't think there might be a few diferences between WebOS on a device with a gesture area, hardware keyboard, and mini cards versus a slab with no gesture area, no keyboard, and a comparatively huge amount of real estate to fill?
    Of course there are going to be differences, but *** does that have to do with me not liking iOS at all and the webOS apps that I do like? I've seen the TouchPad & enyo demos and I like what I've seen. If the enyo version of facebook, just allowed more posts to be seen on the screen, I'd be fine with that.
  16. Zyphlin's Avatar
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    #36  
    Here's the thing about Apps. Its fine and dandy some of you can say "I'll just use the mobile portal". That's great. You can absolutely do that on WebOS.

    You can also do it on iOS.

    But there ARE people who would rather have an app specificly designed for it. There's a LARGE chance that, if that company/service has an app, that there is one for iOS. Not the case with WebOS.

    Saying "Well, our app catalog shouldn't be complained about because you can just use a web portal" completely and utterly misses the point. Simply because its good for YOU doens't mean its good. When the opposition can offer what you're offering ("Just use the web") AND can offer an alternative you're not ("...or use an app") then you are inferior in that regard to your competitor.
  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by pavvento View Post
    What's essential is relative to the user. For some having a photo app that views photos is essential, for others a full photo editor is essential. The fact remains that for many tasks a well developed app is more desirable than a webpage.
    When it comes to a webpage verse a native app there really are only a few things you need to consider.

    • Do you need to store data on the device, possibly for offline access?
    • Do you need to access APIs of the device?
    • Is the device's browser able to supply the needed file system interaction you require?
    • Does the browser have the needed web technologies to support your site?


    Answer those questions and that tells you if you need a native app for something or not.

    And honestly, I can think of several nice and useful apps that would be better off as web pages rather than iOS apps based on what they do and how they operate.
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Here's the thing about Apps. Its fine and dandy some of you can say "I'll just use the mobile portal". That's great. You can absolutely do that on WebOS.

    You can also do it on iOS.

    But there ARE people who would rather have an app specificly designed for it. There's a LARGE chance that, if that company/service has an app, that there is one for iOS. Not the case with WebOS.

    Saying "Well, our app catalog shouldn't be complained about because you can just use a web portal" completely and utterly misses the point. Simply because its good for YOU doens't mean its good. When the opposition can offer what you're offering ("Just use the web") AND can offer an alternative you're not ("...or use an app") then you are inferior in that regard to your competitor.
    No, this statement actually misses the point. What is an app that essentially replicates what is done by a web portal? It's a shortcut or an icon link which you can actually make on most devices, including iOS. The number of apps in iOS is overly inflated by redundancy of functions and what amounts to marketing for web portals.
  19. #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by Orion Antares View Post
    No, this statement actually misses the point. What is an app that essentially replicates what is done by a web portal? It's a shortcut or an icon link which you can actually make on most devices, including iOS. The number of apps in iOS is overly inflated by redundancy of functions and what amounts to marketing for web portals.
    I think it's a combination of both. The best apps are the ones that add functionality and features. Some apps, however, just makes things easier than the web portal, mobile or not. For example, I love the unofficial PreCentral app in the catalog. Does it provide any features that precentral.net doesn't? Nope. What it does is give me easier access to the things I want to do. I can go to dropbox's website on my pre and it'll take 5 minutes to do what I want, or I can open dropboxify and open or email a file in under 30 seconds.
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by VCI_Cell View Post
    WHY THE SHOUTING?

    Mojo apps will run in an emulator on the TP, with virtual gesture area.
    This is a big problem for people to understand. The apps are not going to be in an Emulator. They will be Emulated on the TouchPad. Yes it sounds like I just repeated my self but the Mojo apps will work as a regular app on the TouchPad with no 'emulator' there. Just a back end one built into the depths of the TouchPad.
    "Life is Hard... it's harder if your stupid"
    - John Wayne
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