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  1. #101  
    Quote Originally Posted by japomani View Post
    Wow, I hope that is sarcasim
    Nope not one bit and if you read what I added...
    BTW what are you going to get if your not getting a Pre3? An iPhone? An Android? You crack me up...because I have an Evo right now and I cry at night because I want WebOS back
    "Life is Hard... it's harder if your stupid"
    - John Wayne
  2. #102  
    Quote Originally Posted by zerohaste View Post
    You should be worried.

    No gesture area on a device that uses 3.0. The only device that uses 3.0. Apps that are built for 3.0 will be made to not use a gesture area.

    What happens when phones finally get 3.0? No apps that uses the area, so there's no need to put on on the phone, either. I'm willing to bet Pre 3 and Veer will not be getting 3.0. They're sticking with 2.x and the phones after those will be using 3.0. Old apps that uses the gesture area are now called "legacy" apps by HP themselves. They will stop support for them eventually, just like PalmOS support was removed with 2.0
    Hmm. That's my only real fear when it comes to webOS 2.0 vs. 3.0. I mean if the tablet works without them, maybe that will turn out fine. But if a software update for the phone potentially takes away a feature like that, that would be an unfortunate move.
  3. #103  
    I just got back from the #ThinkBeyond event and was hands-on with these devices - with the exception of the ThinkPad (which no one could touch). I must admit that it is rather funny to see everyone complaining about specific items without knowing the reasons or thought processes behind these designs. I saw a LOT of developers there and I honestly believe that 99% will echo my comments - these things are HOT and are designed to compete.

    Yes, I was rather surprised at the Pad not having a gesture area at first, but when I saw the direction they were going with the new software - I could totally see why HP would choose to not use that item. Would I personally like it on the Pad - yes. With the new software and layouts, do I think it is needed on the device - No. With the larger display area, the Pad uses a newer pane design and UI tweaks that are amazing and incredibly forward thinking.

    I literally got off my flight an hour ago and haven't pulled any pictures off of my device from either event, but will post soon.

    I will say this to any nay-sayers who are griping about what's missing on the Pad, or how Palm messed up with the Pre3... you haven't seen these devices, you haven't held these devices, and you haven't experienced what HP's cash has brought into Palm for making these devices absolutely amazing. There will be devices on Sprint. There will be some tweaking before it happens, but they are coming.
    Last edited by HelloNNNewman; 02/11/2011 at 04:00 AM. Reason: typo
  4. #104  
    Ack! Stop that! Now!

    Now, back to our regular griping, err, prgraming.

    Great to hear HN, looking forward to the pics.
    I see pandas.
  5. #105  
    Quote Originally Posted by PrinceAlbert View Post
    Ack! Stop that! Now!

    Now, back to our regular griping, err, prgraming.

    Great to hear HN, looking forward to the pics.
    We apologize for the interruption and now return you to your regularly scheduled bad programming.


    Sent from my eVo
    Sent from my favorite gadget!
  6. #106  
    Quote Originally Posted by HelloNNNewman View Post
    I just got back from the #ThinkBeyond event and was hands-on with these devices - with the exception of the ThinkPad (which no one could touch). I must admit that it is rather funny to see everyone complaining about specific items without knowing the reasons or thought processes behind these designs. I saw a LOT of developers there and I honestly believe that 99% will echo my comments - these things are HOT and are designed to compete.

    Yes, I was rather surprised at the Pad not having a gesture area at first, but when I saw the direction they were going with the new software - I could totally see why HP would choose to not use that item. Would I personally like it on the Pad - yes. With the new software and layouts, do I think it is needed on the device - No. With the larger display area, the Pad uses a newer pane design and UI tweaks that are amazing and incredibly forward thinking.

    I literally got off my flight an hour ago and haven't pulled any pictures off of my device from either event, but will post soon.

    I will say this to any nay-sayers who are griping about what's missing on the Pad, or how Palm messed up with the Pre3... you haven't seen these devices, you haven't held these devices, and you haven't experienced what HP's cash has brought into Palm for making these device absolutely amazing. There will be devices on Sprint. There will be some tweaking before it happens, but they are coming.
    This is great to hear! Were those models infact the very final hardware designs? If not, do you think there is any chance a gesture bar will makes its way to the TouchPad before launch? Thanks for the info HN!
  7. xplode#WN's Avatar
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    #107  
    was wondering the same thing (if gestures could make it back before launch), or if it'd be possible for our homebrew heroes to make some rudimentary gestures work. the first version of webos on launch didn't have the top-down swipe for menus - you had to hit the little title bar area which was tricky. there is no gesture area up top but they were still able to make top-down swiping a recognizable event - so probably something similar would be possible to do for a bottom-up swipe to trigger card-view.

    but then it seems this is a more fundamental omission - the whole interface has been re-thought, apps will be designed without gestures in mind. it seems it is probably way too late in the development for gestures to come back.

    which is really sad, having to hit a button seems like such a monumental step back. from an organic smooth and flexible way to interact with the device, back to old-timey stiff unnatural button hunting/mashing.

    gestures was one way webos was -cooler- than ios, now we're just the same. back to being followers, not leaders.
  8. #108  
    Quote Originally Posted by rickys239 View Post
    This is great to hear! Were those models infact the very final hardware designs? If not, do you think there is any chance a gesture bar will makes its way to the TouchPad before launch? Thanks for the info HN!
    No, there the gesture area will not be coming to the TouchPad. This is because Enyo is moving on to greater things and the gesture area is no longer need. Yes, I like you loved the gesture area, but when you get a nice look on Enyo... boy we will love it.
    "Life is Hard... it's harder if your stupid"
    - John Wayne
  9. PLinger's Avatar
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    #109  
    My interest in the Touchpad significantly dropped when i heard it doesn't have a gesture are. If the future webOS phones don't have a gesture area, I'm never coming back. Enyo looks cool—but so does Honeycomb's renderscript. Gestures really set webOS apart, even Apple is trying to bring them to iOS. I believe all the posters who were at the event, got some hands on with the Touchpad, and insist it's good. However, i cant shake my belief that it would have been even better if HP figured out a way to make gestures work.
  10. #110  
    My real fear is that we'll stop seeing the gesture area after the Veer and Pre 3, because we'll be using 3.0. Do you think it'll work as well as on the TouchPad? Because the size of the screen is significantly smaller, and tapping a button is way harder than making a gesture.

    What about the new notifications system? I prefer the one we have right now, it's simpler and is more suited to phones.

    Thoughts, anyone?
  11. #111  
    Quote Originally Posted by japomani View Post
    That is a great point! I use the wave all the time. I will miss it's convenience. But I have seen similar things on the android and playbook without a gesture area, just swipe in from the bezel and navigation and controls appear.
    Yea but then it's just like a pop up menu. It's not a "wave"
  12. xplode#WN's Avatar
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    #112  
    so you say we will love the enyo approach - can you help us out a little, you who have seen/experienced it in action? it's hard to imagine i guess how something gesture-less can be more innovative than that, it seems like a step back, not forward or even sideways. can you give us some hints as to how it works?

    to me it seems it would involve hitting certain areas of the screen to move between scenes, grabbing handles to drag like in the email app or something such. i.e. button-hunting, to me. that's a step back.

    the thing with gestures is you don't have to care where the stuff is in the gui, or where the "home" button is. you just swipe up, wherever you like in a large general area without looking. fluid and smooth. now i have to look and see where the button is, then hit it and hopefully not miss. sometimes it will be on the bottom (portrait) and sometimes on the side (landscape).

    with the bezel a gesture area following orientation you could just have swiped up, wherever you are.

    how is that not a step back?

    i would love to hear more details to put our fears to rest - i'm somewhat relieved by the enthusiasm from those of you who have had some experience with it - i just don't get it though.
  13. #113  
    Quote Originally Posted by Rennat View Post
    No, there the gesture area will not be coming to the TouchPad. This is because Enyo is moving on to greater things and the gesture area is no longer need. Yes, I like you loved the gesture area, but when you get a nice look on Enyo... boy we will love it.
    I'm having trouble believing that Enyo seemingly makes back gestures obsolete. Granted, from the demos, it seems as if you generally don't need any back gestures at all given the screen real estate and the multiple panes. However, I did notice an instance, in the photos app, that once you view a full-screen photo, the only way to go back was through a software button on the top left (ala iPhone). Doubt this will be the only instance.

    I firmly believe that even if Enyo diminishes the use of back gestures, it won't eliminate them entirely. Plus, let's not ignore other gestures like swipe up, the quick launch wave, and the forward gesture, which some developers have found ingenious uses for.

    Consistency is key. The phones will always need a gesture bar since the screens are too small to have all the window panes of the tablet. In certain cases, the tablet will need "a way to go back," so gestures make sense.

    FINALLY, that light bar LOOKS SO COOL! Be cool HP. Don't ditch the gesture area!
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    #114  
    They should have kept a gesture area in the middle of each side, and had a Pre "Home" button on one side for intuitiveness.

    This doesn't seem like a big deal in my opinion - webOS 3.0 and Enyo were designed to work without needed a gesture area. They didn't make it clear, but they should have, that legacy mojo apps would run in the center of the screen, not resized at all, and with emulated functions that the gesture area provided.
    Peace, Freedom, Prosperity.

    If you have a complaint/request relating to webOS please use the Feedback & Feature Requests Form at the official site.
  15. #115  
    Quote Originally Posted by HelloNNNewman View Post
    I just got back from the #ThinkBeyond event and was hands-on with these devices - with the exception of the ThinkPad (which no one could touch). I must admit that it is rather funny to see everyone complaining about specific items without knowing the reasons or thought processes behind these designs. I saw a LOT of developers there and I honestly believe that 99% will echo my comments - these things are HOT and are designed to compete.

    Yes, I was rather surprised at the Pad not having a gesture area at first, but when I saw the direction they were going with the new software - I could totally see why HP would choose to not use that item. Would I personally like it on the Pad - yes. With the new software and layouts, do I think it is needed on the device - No. With the larger display area, the Pad uses a newer pane design and UI tweaks that are amazing and incredibly forward thinking.

    I literally got off my flight an hour ago and haven't pulled any pictures off of my device from either event, but will post soon.

    I will say this to any nay-sayers who are griping about what's missing on the Pad, or how Palm messed up with the Pre3... you haven't seen these devices, you haven't held these devices, and you haven't experienced what HP's cash has brought into Palm for making these device absolutely amazing. There will be devices on Sprint. There will be some tweaking before it happens, but they are coming.


    its like the sky split apart and a webOS god floated into PC bring hope to the desperate!
  16. #116  
    Erm... all good and well I suppose: I haven't seen nor held the device and I always make sure to get hands on with devices before buying.

    However, I have read the specs and I don't think seeing or holding the device is going to suddenly improve my opinion of them. Specs are fine right now. In 6 months? I'm thinking not so much.
  17. #117  
    What is the process for switching between open apps on Enyo? I love the advanced gesture for switching apps. It looks like every time you are done working in one app and want to switch to another, you have to find the "home" button and go back to card view. You should just be able to swipe from the side of the screen. Swiping up should get to card view. There doesn't need to be a gesture area necessarily, but the functionality of the gestures needs to remain. Just like was pointed out with the menu bar, the gesture area doesn't need to be there for the device to recognize, hell even TealOS on my Treo could do the gestures. They need to keep the functionality, even if not all apps need to use it.
  18. #118  
    Most people use a tablet only in two ways. The tilt it to the left or to the right. There are just a few person wich would use a pad on all for possible ways.

    The first gesturebar would have been central on the bottom, for the average use. It would just work as it does on the webOS phones. Backswipe, forward and so on.
    The second gesturebar would be on the right side. Also in the middle. This area would be the scrollbar for the most simple apps, like browser or mail. When holding this gesturebar and moving to the screen, you would pop out a wavebar like you do with the phone, but this wavebar would only show a specific app-menu-bar.
    For the brwoser this could be a quickaction for sharing, adding to bookmarks, zoom in/out, translate or any other quickaction you would like to add.

    This is the way you would work safe with the pad, when you are holding it. Just imagine you are standing and holding the pad with both hands. You could work fast with you thumb, but are also holding the pad thight with both hands.

    I would have also added the two cards interface. Two cards at the same time opened up, this is true multitasking and would be a feature apples ios would copy from webos. This feature alone could be a "killer"-argument for the PalmPad.
    When two windows/cards are open the second gesture bar would gain some special operations for this modus. With it you could lock one of the two cards for example.

    Example: You are watching a Hulu movie and you received a important mail, but down want to stop you movie. Lock the one card. and open up the app-launcher (this will automaticly open in just one half of the screen) choose the mail app (this fills the not locked screenspace, so that mail an hulu are open at the same time) and write you mail while watching you hulu movie. Other example are videoconference while simutanously handling the presentation you are showing.

    There are so many more ideas you could do with two bar. But using a button? This is like inventing the wheel and making it a square. A big step backwards.

    I cant believe nobody of HP had this idea. They only made a webos ipad. Apple always used a homebutton, but webos the gesturebar. So why changing. Dont copy apple, dont the a sheep. Step ahead and be leader.
  19. #119  
    can anyone tell me wherher the plan is for webos 3 to eventually go on phones? Does webos 3have zero gestures meaning eventually gestures will be gone from webos entirely?

    this is so dumb...a swipe up to get the home/kauncher is a key part of the nimble multitasking. Also, on a pad, wouldn't slow swipe up or double tap gesture area to get the keyboard have made sense???

    anyway, someone please tell me if Enyo /webos 3 eliminates all gestures.
  20. #120  
    i think that moving forward, HP decided they're going to do away with the gesture area completely. soon we'll see phones that don't have it either.

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