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  1. JKM
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    #61  
    I think the problem with the gesture area was that it was not self-explanatory.
    A new user will not know that a black area below or at the side of the panel has some purpose
    and how to use it. The user will have to read the manual to understand it.
    But most users don't read manuals.

    I think they wanted a device that a new user could use immediately without consulting a manual.
  2. bennish's Avatar
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    #62  
    oh bloody hell. I didn't know about this. Gesture area was one of the things I was looking forward to... landscape scrolling like on the pre?

    Damn.
    [twitter]_____[blog]______[im]__
    For now: Nexus One | iPad 2
    When avail. in Aus: Pre3 16GB | Touchpad 16GB

    This is a forum for WebOS enthusiasts. It is not a place for negative rants about Palm, HP or WebOS.
    Criticism is important but so is a positive environment. Remember, we're here because we love WebOS.
  3. bennish's Avatar
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    #63  
    Quote Originally Posted by blue duck butter View Post
    I noticed there aren't any gestures on the TouchPad. Do you think this is because RIM maybe has patents for gestures on their Playbook? I know the gestures for webOS on smartphones must be patented already but maybe HP didn't have them patented for a tablet device?
    If RIM has done that... that's low. REAAAL low. Dirty. Stealing not only the cards concept, but the gesture area?

    That's bloody disgusting.
    [twitter]_____[blog]______[im]__
    For now: Nexus One | iPad 2
    When avail. in Aus: Pre3 16GB | Touchpad 16GB

    This is a forum for WebOS enthusiasts. It is not a place for negative rants about Palm, HP or WebOS.
    Criticism is important but so is a positive environment. Remember, we're here because we love WebOS.
  4. ndz
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    #64  
    The absence of webOS gestures on the Touchpad killed any interest I had in the device. It was the main feature I was looking forward to.
  5. art_sjc's Avatar
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    #65  
    Quote Originally Posted by bennish View Post
    Stealing not only the cards concept, but the gesture area?
    That's just the thing though - HP claims the lack of a viable gesture area is the reason they dropped it for the TouchPad, but RIM was able to solve that by making the entire screen support gestures and being smart about recognizing them.

    Gah, I can't believe I just wrote that...
  6. #66  
    Quote Originally Posted by blue duck butter View Post
    I noticed there aren't any gestures on the TouchPad. Do you think this is because RIM maybe has patents for gestures on their Playbook? I know the gestures for webOS on smartphones must be patented already but maybe HP didn't have them patented for a tablet device?
    I haven't searched the patent office but if Palm has a patent on gestures on a phone (or someone else), then RIM couldn't patent it on a tablet. After using gestures on a phone, it would be obvious that one could do that on a tablet. Obviousness makes a patent invalid. For whatever reason, Palm decided not to do it.
  7. #67  
    Quote Originally Posted by JKM View Post
    I think the problem with the gesture area was that it was not self-explanatory.
    A new user will not know that a black area below or at the side of the panel has some purpose
    and how to use it. The user will have to read the manual to understand it.
    But most users don't read manuals.

    I think they wanted a device that a new user could use immediately without consulting a manual.
    Hmm, this argument is a bit thin. IIRC, the original Pre came without a manual, and most of us had no problem then.

    I'm actually quite happy with the idea of developing customised gesture areas on a per-app basis.
  8. #68  
    I sent a long time talking to HP about the gesture interface. The extra screen real estate of a tablet screen makes the gesture area less of an issue. The tap-to-share button also seems to have replaced the back-swipe, and there are buttons within the apps to provide action. After several detailed demos and conversations, I've decided that they made a good choice.
  9. #69  
    You still have all the classic gestures. Basically the only thing that changes is the tap to put it into Cardview.
  10. pico23's Avatar
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    #70  
    Wow...so we went from gestures and lack of home buttons (technically even the Pre minus didn't need the button) to home buttons and needing to close apps with ????

    Sounds like HP tried to hard to recreate iOS or WinMo, unfortunately, iOS has apps!

    Gestures were one of the differentiating features of webOS. Another loss!
  11. #71  
    it appears to me that the Enyo framework and sizes of the device eliminates the need for a gesture area. notice that during the presentation, they never had to "go back" a scene. all of the scenes were available by just manipulated the windows.

    gesture area makes sense on the phones though, since there isn't enough space to have all of the scenes in view...

    noo worries here
  12. #72  
    I believe that in the future, some of the applications which need the gesture will use some kind of virtual one like there was the virtual graffitiy area on the tungsten3
  13. #73  
    Makes it look (to outsiders) like it is copying iPad, which it isn't. That should most definitely be a gesture area. I'm disappointed too. HP
    Palm m105 >> Zire 72SE >> AT&T Pre Plus >> Pre 2 (cracked)>>HP Veer/Pre 2>>Touchpad>>Pre 3...and I'm only 17 years old! (My own savings)
  14. DDT1345's Avatar
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    #74  
    Quote Originally Posted by Editor02 View Post
    Makes it look (to outsiders) like it is copying iPad, which it isn't. That should most definitely be a gesture area. I'm disappointed too. HP
    I agree completely. The gesture area is the #1 differentiator. I really just can't get over the fact that it is gone. How do you get rid of the #1 thing that makes this OS elegant when compared to the others?

    The latest article says it has a toolbar! Wow! How innovative! A toolbar with "back" and "forward" buttons at the top of the screen. I am just shocked that people at HP had to sit around a table and MAKE THE DECISION to throw away a key advantage/differentiator between them and the iPad.

    On my pre, just a simple swipe does so many convenient things, now I'll have to reach up to the top of the screen for the drop down toolbar?!

    ugh, I know I'm probably overreacting, but I had high hopes and am SOOOOO DISSAPPOINTED


    NO GESTURE AREA = APOCALYPTIC FAIL

    ...and don't get me started on the stupid name.
  15. DDT1345's Avatar
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    #75  
    Quote Originally Posted by ndz View Post
    The absence of webOS gestures on the Touchpad killed any interest I had in the device. It was the main feature I was looking forward to.
    +1E99
  16. #76  
    Quote Originally Posted by blue duck butter View Post
    I noticed there aren't any gestures on the TouchPad. Do you think this is because RIM maybe has patents for gestures on their Playbook? I know the gestures for webOS on smartphones must be patented already but maybe HP didn't have them patented for a tablet device?
    I doubt that is the reason since most companies file patents not just for the device they are making it for. Believe it or not most companies are pretty forward thinking and patents are needed to e competitive so special care is taken with the wording .

    In my opinion the gesture are has been removed but not the gestures themselves similar to android 3.0 removing physical buttons but not the actual functionality. I think it is because of 2 things a) cost and b) usability. They would have had to add a gesture area on all four sides for the feature to be usable/consistent and not confusing for new comers which would have increased cost by a lot. The same thing can be done with on screen gestures without the use of a gesture area (not 100% sure if that is the case since they did not show any one using back gesture but this is plausible).

    This also helps with providing a user with something which they are already familiar with. One button to rule them all
  17. spare's Avatar
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    #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by Cantaffordit View Post
    I sent a long time talking to HP about the gesture interface. The extra screen real estate of a tablet screen makes the gesture area less of an issue. The tap-to-share button also seems to have replaced the back-swipe, and there are buttons within the apps to provide action. After several detailed demos and conversations, I've decided that they made a good choice.
    But how do existing 3rd party apps function without a back swipe?

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
  18. #78  
    I know it may seem ridiculous to be upset over the lack of gesture area to some but I agree that the swipe to bring up card view was so elegant and intuitive. Even more so since you can just tap the area like a button if you want.

    I have been playing with the iPad the last couple of weeks and I like the tablet form factor for may of those casual computing tasks and especially media consumption. My problem is with the navigation. It just doesn't work as well as it should or could. I get the one thing at a time model for the iPhone and its small screen and can live without multitasking there. I can see the one button that is always easy to press no matter how you hold the phone (just not all that big).

    On a tablet the button can often be quite far to reach and you have to know which way you are holding it but there is no reason to really care since the screen shifts with orientation. If you can quickly get the correct screen orientation from the accelerometer then it should be trivial to decide which of the gesture areas are at the bottom and light up the LED bar to indicate that is where the gesture area is. You want to get even more useful let the left and right (or user selectable left or right) side gesture area become scrolling regions for long lists or the web. There could even be another LED indicator that the sides are able to scroll.

    I really think the switch to a physical button and removal of the gesture area is a step back.

    On a related note I noticed that nobody swiped down to reveal any system menus or the notifications area. I am hoping this is just an early release thing or an incomplete tour. Again with the iPad comparisons taping always feels more difficult that swiping. I pick up my pre and swipe around and then the iPad and I tap here then there and it is less intuitive than just sliding things around.

    As I write this I am starting to think of dozens of other things that rely on the swiping gesture that I use all the time (back anyone!?!?!?). I have been holding an iPad thinking if only I didn't have to hit some tiny stupid back button all the way up in the top corner of the screen. I was only consoled by the fact that I "knew" that when the new webOS tablet came out I would get that functionality.
    Last edited by soundguise; 02/10/2011 at 09:36 AM.
    Palm Devices: Palm IIIe -> Palm IIIxe -> CLIÉ N760C -> Tungsten T3 -> Pre Plus
  19. ijip's Avatar
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    #79  
    i think they will update it. i remember reading about two finger swipes and such.... hopefully they just were not ready or did not want to show it off yet....
  20. #80  
    the lack of a gesture area makes this device seem a lot less appealing to me. i really doubt i'll be getting one. plus, this thing has virtually no apps and since devs have been hesitant to develop for webOS thus far, i don't see any reason why that would be changing anytime soon.
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