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  1. #101  
    3 of my 6 that are not working were DOA on first boot. Two of them just send telephone-modem-like sound to the other party. One is a completely dead mic. Sometimes they'll pass audio diagnostics, or record audio with the camcorder, but audio through the phone does not work on any of them, ever. 2 send screeching noises, the other 3 are silent. The two screeching ones lead me to believe modem failure, except that they also often fail to record sound in diagnostic or camcorder (silent, not screeches). (the 6th dead one has shattered glass, and was otherwise functional last i knew) 2 of them the silence occured after some time using -- one after months, the other after days.

    One of them is able to make a single call before going silent.

    The saddest part is all of them were retail destined. I'm sitting here with a Verizon unit also that has never been used, and probably never will be :|
    Author:
    Remove Messaging Beeps patch for webOS 3.0.5, Left/Right bezel gestures in LunaCE,
    Whazaa! Messenger and node-wa, SynerGV 1 and 2 - Google Voice integration, XO - Subsonic Commander media streamer, AB:S Launcher
    (1:39:33 PM) halfhalo: Android multitasking is like sticking your fingers into a blender
    GO OPEN WEBOS!
    People asked me for a donate link for my non-catalog work, so here you are:
  2. #102  
    Well, all this is very scary....

    There are some options that are not mentioned :

    1) a defected batch of chips
    2) a batch of units with defective soldering
  3. #103  
    Quote Originally Posted by mazzinia View Post
    Well, all this is very scary....

    There are some options that are not mentioned :

    1) a defected batch of chips
    2) a batch of units with defective soldering
    Hhmm.. yes!

    Dry Solder Joints: I owned an early Panasonic Camcorder that became similarly dysfunctional after about a year, when I returned it for repair.
    It was suggested that continual heat-up<-->cool-down cycles (especially those extremes experienced when driving through the Australian desert!), resulted in the thermal expansion/contraction microscopically 'cracking' any physically stressed solder joints.

    The repairer in that case deliberately 'over-soldered' the faulty joints and it remained stable thereafter.

    SO.. just perhaps, the earlier prognosis of 'heat' could be a partially correct one?
    Certainly the Touchstone in hot weather can cause the device to really hot up.

    ..Now I recall that I have received a couple of 'over-temperature' warnings a couple here in the past.
    But hey.. that is what they are for aren't they?

    Last edited by Mutoidi; 04/28/2015 at 07:04 AM.

    TP 32Gb 4G. 3.0.5 / CM10. ~ Pre3 16Gb GSM. 2.2.4. ~ TS2 BT Audio-Dock ~ HP iPaq. hx-2790b.
    TP 32Gb Wifi. 3.0.5 / CM10. ~ Veer (Wht.) 8Gb GSM. 2.2.4. ~ HP Omen-15-5206tx. 256Gb SSD. i7-O/C@3.39Ghz. Win10.
  4. #104  
    too many variables. if really solder joints, it could be fixed professionally, as you pointed out... I wonder if who does that job has means also to check the joints in advance.

    could also be that there are multiple issues ( hw or soldering in some units , sw in others ), too
  5. #105  
    Quote Originally Posted by mazzinia View Post
    too many variables. if really solder joints, it could be fixed professionally, as you pointed out... I wonder if who does that job has means also to check the joints in advance.

    could also be that there are multiple issues ( hw or soldering in some units , sw in others ), too
    Yes.. of course there are 'too many variables'! That is why we have not succeeded in nailing the source of this glitch yet - surely?

    But at least we now have a (growing) list of serious possibilities.

    I am wondering how and why a dry solder joint could initially 'appear' to be rectified by a software reset?

    PS. After reverting back to Uberkernel, my device continues to show 'Modem Error #1000' on tests.

    Last edited by Mutoidi; 04/28/2015 at 10:45 AM.

    TP 32Gb 4G. 3.0.5 / CM10. ~ Pre3 16Gb GSM. 2.2.4. ~ TS2 BT Audio-Dock ~ HP iPaq. hx-2790b.
    TP 32Gb Wifi. 3.0.5 / CM10. ~ Veer (Wht.) 8Gb GSM. 2.2.4. ~ HP Omen-15-5206tx. 256Gb SSD. i7-O/C@3.39Ghz. Win10.
  6. #106  
    Maybe someone could post the maker of of the modem and they might have a website or data sheet that would list what the error codes mean...
  7. #107  
    That's why I mentioned some units having hw/joints and others having sw issues, maybe.
    The reset and/or running tests would fix only a sw issue.

    Moving on the sw side, I keep thinking that one sw/patch (but sw looks more likely) manages to change a register (probably stored in a small small permanent ram area on the chip) in a way that is not supposed to be done.
    That could be due to using an api that has issues, or could be due by not performing some specific calls (on exit or after doing something).

    Some small registers are limited in "bits", and if you pass the max, you end going negative.
    A negative number/value could be an issue, especially if it's a volume or volume related.
  8. #108  
    Quote Originally Posted by mazzinia View Post
    Some small registers are limited in "bits", and if you pass the max, you end going negative.
    A negative number/value could be an issue, especially if it's a volume or volume related.
    Right. So in theory, would the Doctoring process clear/reset those excess 'bits' from the RAM area you refer to?

    TP 32Gb 4G. 3.0.5 / CM10. ~ Pre3 16Gb GSM. 2.2.4. ~ TS2 BT Audio-Dock ~ HP iPaq. hx-2790b.
    TP 32Gb Wifi. 3.0.5 / CM10. ~ Veer (Wht.) 8Gb GSM. 2.2.4. ~ HP Omen-15-5206tx. 256Gb SSD. i7-O/C@3.39Ghz. Win10.
  9. #109  
    Quote Originally Posted by Mutoidi View Post
    Right. So in theory, would the Doctoring process clear/reset those excess 'bits' from the RAM area you refer to?
    It might be possible that one of the firmwares that holds onto stuff more permanently than a Doctor could be reset. Like when we do a reset on the TouchPad's A6.. the Pre3 also has two A6's.. although I'd suspect that that would only affect charging, touchstoning, and tap-to-sharing, as that's what the A6's did.. but there might be something related to the modem or other things, that is not normally reset through a Doctor ...

    If anyone comes up with any bright ideas, let me know, I'll charge one up. As is, I'm about to put all my stuff that isn't my main touchpad in a box :-S
    Author:
    Remove Messaging Beeps patch for webOS 3.0.5, Left/Right bezel gestures in LunaCE,
    Whazaa! Messenger and node-wa, SynerGV 1 and 2 - Google Voice integration, XO - Subsonic Commander media streamer, AB:S Launcher
    (1:39:33 PM) halfhalo: Android multitasking is like sticking your fingers into a blender
    GO OPEN WEBOS!
    People asked me for a donate link for my non-catalog work, so here you are:
  10. #110  
    I cannot say that a doctor would do also a reset, but clearly the audio test does a kind of reset since people here reported that it made the mic work again.

    Now it would help finding out what exactly the test does as in which functions it calls...
  11. #111  
    Some more tests:

    I know this phone has a Qualcomm chipset, but I don't know if that includes the modem or if that is made by another manufacturer. Qualcomms website didn't seem to be useful - maybe I need to be a developer.

    Out of interest, I tried the voice dialler - something I never really use. It failed to respond to anything.

    Instead of the quick test, I ran the interactive ones - specifically the audio section.
    Tests that recorded and played back using the main microphone AND the headset (palm standard) failed.
    This suggests a fault upstream from both microphones...

    Interestingly, the first test, which played a sound, was audible, but very faint.
    Next recording from the main mic - Total Fail.
    Speakerphone (playback only) - Pass
    Headphone - insertion and removal detection - both passed.
    Headphone playback - Pass
    Headphone record / playback - Fail

    I tried the quick tests again - modem error 20. The only lists of GSM error codes I can find state that 20 is 'Out of memory' , but there was no code 1000, so these codes might be specific to HP/Palm & mean something else.
    http://www.smssolutions.net/tutorial...gsmerrorcodes/

    After the quick tests, there was no improvement, so I rebooted. This fixed the problem and all tests were passed. Of note is that the first test - designed I think to be listened to with the phone to the ear, seemed louder and clearer, but still a bit crackly.

    So... one plus is that if you need to make an important call, you can get through these tests quickly and be confident your mic is live or reboot and test if there's a problem. You can also use Skype's echo service for this. There's no embarrassment of making silent calls to people, then having to take a few mins to reboot before redialling with your explanations. Receiving calls when you can't be heard is slightly less embarrassing...

    It's not clear to me that the quick tests are a fix - obviously it has to fail before I can test fixes.

    My experience with my old PalmOS phone was the old tricky headphone socket issue which made calls silent on both ends (deaf & mute). The temp fix was using the headset and it was largely fixed with a thorough cleaning. The mic problem on the Pre3 could be a socket issue, but that both mics fail and are fixed with a reboot again points to a software or intermittent hardware failure.

    More...

    So with a functioning mic, I ran the quick tests again and watched carefully. There are 4 tests, 1. Memory seemed to take a good two minutes. 2. was WiFi - pretty quick, 3. was the modem - this was when I got the big yellow triangle and again the error code, 20 so I don't know what test 4 is. Maybe 20 IS out of memory. Maybe something is filling the memory of the modem and blocking transmission, but not reception?

    However, I ran the interactive tests again and all was still working! As is Skype echo

    I doubt anyone who actually knows will be passing these forums... so I guess it's time to start fiddling to see what might prevent the issue, but it's fumbling in the dark a bit!
    http://www.smssolutions.net/hardware/gsmgprs2/
    Last edited by Preemptive; 05/01/2015 at 03:21 AM.
  12. #112  
    Hi guys, just to let you know that today I panicked. My Pre3 mic did not work, several reboots did not work. Then I thought, of course... webosnation, got here, tried some of the tricks mentioned and voilá, the quick test did the trick! Pre3 again working 100%
    Dell Axim X5 -> Palm Tungsten T -> Palm Tungsten T3 -> Palm Tungsten T -> Palm Treo Pro + MicroSD 4GB -> Palm Pre 2 (Lost it) -> Palm Pixi Plus -> Palm Pre 2 -> HP Veer -> Palm Pre 2 -> HP Pre 3
    Preemptive and Mutoidi like this.
  13. #113  
    If I could ever find cheap GSM service for a SIM card that is Pre sized, I would activate another Pre3. :-S
    Author:
    Remove Messaging Beeps patch for webOS 3.0.5, Left/Right bezel gestures in LunaCE,
    Whazaa! Messenger and node-wa, SynerGV 1 and 2 - Google Voice integration, XO - Subsonic Commander media streamer, AB:S Launcher
    (1:39:33 PM) halfhalo: Android multitasking is like sticking your fingers into a blender
    GO OPEN WEBOS!
    People asked me for a donate link for my non-catalog work, so here you are:
  14. #114  
    Quote Originally Posted by guilledil View Post
    Hi guys, just to let you know that today I panicked. My Pre3 mic did not work, several reboots did not work. Then I thought, of course... webosnation, got here, tried some of the tricks mentioned and voilá, the quick test did the trick! Pre3 again working 100%
    Cool!
    Please let us know how the mic holds up now.. I thought I had mine nailed for a few joyous days, but then it reverted to being dysFUNctional again.. and has instead now become my 'camera' - mostly.

    PS. @ 'Preemptive' ~ did you ever get any closer to being able to successfully 'speak' to yours??

    Last edited by Mutoidi; 04/11/2016 at 04:49 PM. Reason: PS

    TP 32Gb 4G. 3.0.5 / CM10. ~ Pre3 16Gb GSM. 2.2.4. ~ TS2 BT Audio-Dock ~ HP iPaq. hx-2790b.
    TP 32Gb Wifi. 3.0.5 / CM10. ~ Veer (Wht.) 8Gb GSM. 2.2.4. ~ HP Omen-15-5206tx. 256Gb SSD. i7-O/C@3.39Ghz. Win10.
  15. #115  
    Quote Originally Posted by Mutoidi View Post
    @ 'Preemptive' ~ did you ever get any closer to being able to successfully 'speak' to yours??

    I actually had to re-read this thread to remind myself.

    I'm not a heavy caller, but I have not noticed this problem since the post above. I'm still using the same phone. I've never doctored it.
  16. #116  
    Quote Originally Posted by Mutoidi View Post
    Cool!
    Please let us know how the mic holds up now.. I thought I had mine nailed for a few joyous days, but then it reverted to being dysFUNctional again.. and has instead now become my 'camera' - mostly.

    PS. @ 'Preemptive' ~ did you ever get any closer to being able to successfully 'speak' to yours??

    Hi again... Unfortunately it looks like i called victory too early. As you can see I am typing on an Android device.. Ohh nooo.

    My mic continued working for a couple of days but then again kaput.. Did the quick tests and began working again. After a week i must say my mic is completely dead now.. I have not been able to make it work again. All the tricks plus a full erase and a visit to the doctor and no responseee

    Enviado desde mi Optimus G mediante Tapatalk
    Dell Axim X5 -> Palm Tungsten T -> Palm Tungsten T3 -> Palm Tungsten T -> Palm Treo Pro + MicroSD 4GB -> Palm Pre 2 (Lost it) -> Palm Pixi Plus -> Palm Pre 2 -> HP Veer -> Palm Pre 2 -> HP Pre 3
  17. #117  
    Damn.. and that's a shame. But I know how that feels!
    I wonder if 'Preemptive' is right in his musings that it may be a (software) 'memory leak' Issue to an area that no Doctor can reach, as opposed to a hardware failure?

    The only other thing I did with mine that may be a clue, was to leave it on the live touchstone - for days at a time sometimes - and in the hot Aussie summers it did complain about high temperatures a few times.. but that would be classed as a hardware breakdown I reckon?

    Maybe the quicktests somehow cleared a bit of 'extra memory' for a short while?

    Thanks anyway.. at least we now have absolute 'verification' of this aberrant behaviour!

    Apotheker has some serious Karma to work out! I mean.. phones with no microphone.. REALLY usefull!


    TP 32Gb 4G. 3.0.5 / CM10. ~ Pre3 16Gb GSM. 2.2.4. ~ TS2 BT Audio-Dock ~ HP iPaq. hx-2790b.
    TP 32Gb Wifi. 3.0.5 / CM10. ~ Veer (Wht.) 8Gb GSM. 2.2.4. ~ HP Omen-15-5206tx. 256Gb SSD. i7-O/C@3.39Ghz. Win10.
    guilledil likes this.
  18. #118  
    Small update: I received a couple of silent calls (at least on my end) last night. I was about to hang up, when I heard some slight hisses - as if there was poor signal that was about to improve... but it didn't. When I looked, I had at least two signal bars and the call was from a landline. I later tried to return the calls and could hear, but not be heard, but on a different call, although it was only the answer phone, I could hear it. At that point, I rebooted, but had no time to try calling again. Today however, the calls came through fine. So... Mic problem? Modem problem? Network problem? I don't know. I've not had any calling issues for ages although my phone has recently recovered from a second bout of crashing, rebooting and resetting to 6th of (some month - June?) 2010 (date of manufacture?). Then some apps won't launch, which may be a timing (although I reset the clock) or database issue. (Pre3 BTW)
  19. #119  
    Do you consider a call (from you), where the called person can not hear you, as a 'calling issue' then?
    Surely a Mic problem at your end, which is what this thread is addressing, simply means that 'they' can not hear You!
    Thanks, but you now have me further confused!

    TP 32Gb 4G. 3.0.5 / CM10. ~ Pre3 16Gb GSM. 2.2.4. ~ TS2 BT Audio-Dock ~ HP iPaq. hx-2790b.
    TP 32Gb Wifi. 3.0.5 / CM10. ~ Veer (Wht.) 8Gb GSM. 2.2.4. ~ HP Omen-15-5206tx. 256Gb SSD. i7-O/C@3.39Ghz. Win10.
  20. #120  
    Well, the first post refers to the microphone, but that a reboot fixes it - therefore more likely a software error than hardware. If I can't hear, I can't tell if anyone can hear me, but sometimes I hear the other person answering and not hearing me. Of course, it might be an intermittent H/W fault, but that would be unlikely to be fixed by a reboot and would probably get worse.

    Whether the phone app is failing to properly 'open' mic and speakers on call initiation, a modem issue or network problem could perhaps be determined by checking logs...

    It's rare enough for me not to be too bothered by it.
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