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  1. #161  
    Quote Originally Posted by JBoogie
    I'm thinking WiFi would allow net access (i.e.: VoIP, LAN, etc.) to happen from their device independent of the cellular network provider which in most cases would result in saving money.......
    Possible. VoIP might save you money on foreign destinations, not included in your contract. However, Wi-Fi is not necessary; VoIP will run over EvDo, EDGE, or UMTS. I have run VoIP from my PC over PDAnet via my Treo to Cingular EDGE. The real limitation is that there is no VoIP application for the Treo. Long before this becomes practical, the transport layer will disappear beneath our level of notice.
  2. #162  
    Only $500?? That's a good price, but I think I'd want the unlocked one. Unless I can get Cingular(or someone else) to unlock the one I buy.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  3. #163  
    Quote Originally Posted by dstrauss
    I thought this thread started out as "700p in December" so what happened to the December release?........
    In Palm-speak December means before the end of June.
  4. #164  
    Lets not forget European users. Cellular data is extremely expensive here. The telcom companies paid 22 billion 4 years ago ($38 billion) for 3G licenses. They intend to make it all back from consumers over the next few years.

    If I wanted to stream some music from my desktop, at current data rates it would cost me $4-8 per song. Needless to say I'm not going to do it, despite the hardware and network being completely capable of doing this. Its wonderful to pay a one time fee and then stream as freely as you like. WIFI is a lifeline, and I would not buy a device without it.

    Surur
  5. #165  
    Quote Originally Posted by whmurray
    Possible. VoIP might save you money on foreign destinations, not included in your contract. However, Wi-Fi is not necessary; VoIP will run over EvDo, EDGE, or UMTS. I have run VoIP from my PC over PDAnet via my Treo to Cingular EDGE. The real limitation is that there is no VoIP application for the Treo. Long before this becomes practical, the transport layer will disappear beneath our level of notice.
    I think you missed my point.... perhaps I should not have mentioned VoIP as there are many other applications one would be able to take advantage of running over a free WiFi connection and therefore not having to pay for doing the same running over a proprietary carriers network.

    So as me and others have stated here that WiFi is very necessary. I'm not even worried about EvDO, EDGE or UMTS as I have no doubts that we'll get that.
    ---
    Handspring Visor Pro + Samsung 8500 (Sprint PCS) -> Handspring Treo 600 (Sprint PCS) -> Palm Treo 650 (Sprint) -> Sony-Ericsson P990 if S-E releases a North-America version
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    #166  
    Quote Originally Posted by whmurray
    This issue has been discussed here ad nauseam. There are some here who view Wi-Fi as being "free" and who do not value coverage. I agree with you.
    So I'm assuming you use EVDO to connect to your private networks and wireless WiFi access points?

    Second as it relates to the limited are of coverage that you guys seem to be focused on, for $45 per month I'd use WiFi any day over EVDO. I have a Boingo account anyways for my laptop. EVDO is still being sold as a high priced luxury good that after tax is another $50 a month.

    Third, JBoogie brings up loads of other reasons.

    Last - having been raped by Verizon on my Treo 600 and 650, I've decided to never rely on proprietary data networks if I can help it. And damn straight I can!
  7. #167  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    So I'm assuming you use EVDO to connect to your private networks and wireless WiFi access points?

    Second as it relates to the limited are of coverage that you guys seem to be focused on, for $45 per month I'd use WiFi any day over EVDO. I have a Boingo account anyways for my laptop. EVDO is still being sold as a high priced luxury good that after tax is another $50 a month.

    Third, JBoogie brings up loads of other reasons.

    Last - having been raped by Verizon on my Treo 600 and 650, I've decided to never rely on proprietary data networks if I can help it. And damn straight I can!

    whmurray is right about the possibility of using VoIP apps etc over 1xEvDo vs wifi. Otherwise this whole WAN vis Wifi debate is rather mute b/c in reality the future may be neither these standards but rather Wimax instead...

    Anyway, if you really wanted to make cogent arguement for the inclusion of wifi in a device besides the typical "we want it" etc arguement, then it would be for the following reasons... to augment existing cellular WAN converage in areas currently not adequetely served.

    Prime examples of instances like this would be inside large buildings, airports, hotels, hospitals and etc where wireless WAN convergae cannot adequetely penetrate for mobile phone use. In this case, it would be in the interest of wireless carrier to support wifi b/c it would improve their own converage and they would require seamless automatic wireless switching (which is supported in latest WM). Thus the inclusion of wifi on various WM devices like the wizard etc...
    _________________
    aka Gfunkmagic

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  8. #168  
    When the whole Wifi debate was the rage this time last year, I posted my point of view. Even though it is a year later the major points still hold true with me today:

    Whiners whining about the Wifi whiners whining about no Wifi!

    Just MHO.
  9. #169  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    Last - having been raped by Verizon on my Treo 600 and 650, I've decided to never rely on proprietary data networks if I can help it. And damn straight I can!
    This is the main reason I like wi-fi!
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  10. #170  
    Some of us might want to use WiFi on our LAN to control our HTPC or wirelessly sync or share files.

    Honestly, those who don't care for it should just respect that some people have an honestly good use for it and just STFU. Why is this even an argument?!?!?!
    Palm III -> Palm Vx -> Clie T615c -> Clie T665c -> Tungsten T|3 -> Treo 650 -> Trew 700W (for a few days) -> XV6700 -> Moto Q
    http://geckotek.blogspot.com
  11. #171  
    Quote Originally Posted by whmurray
    In Palm-speak December means before the end of June.
    June of WHAT year?
    Remember, the "P" in PDA stands for personal.
    If it works for you, it is "P"erfect.
  12. #172  
    Quote Originally Posted by Geckotek
    Some of us might want to use WiFi on our LAN to control our HTPC or wirelessly sync or share files.

    Honestly, those who don't care for it should just respect that some people have an honestly good use for it and just STFU. Why is this even an argument?!?!?!

    It's just a debate bro...no need to get excited.

    I posed the question b/c many people here have adamantly stated that not having wifi in the next gen WM or palmos treo would be a deciding factor NOT to buy it. I was just wondering why and if this was truely the case...
    _________________
    aka Gfunkmagic

    Current device: Palm Pre
    Device graveyard: Palm Vx, Cassiopeia E100, LG Phenom HPC, Palm M515, Treo 300, Treo 600, Treo 650, Treo 700p, Axim X50v, Treo 800w



    Please don't PM me about my avatar. For more info go here.

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  13. #173  
    Sorry, but as mentioned before, this has been discussed ad-nauseum. Guess I just signed on for the first time in a while (to check status of the 700P....ever hopeful) and got a little sensitive since I saw the same discussion.....AGAIN.

    I'll probably buy w/o WiFi, but I hope it has it.
    Palm III -> Palm Vx -> Clie T615c -> Clie T665c -> Tungsten T|3 -> Treo 650 -> Trew 700W (for a few days) -> XV6700 -> Moto Q
    http://geckotek.blogspot.com
  14. #174  
    I can very much see the advantage of integrated WiFi. Yes, EV-DO is supposedly as good as low end broadband, but when you're at the office , home, or a client with true WiFi, it would be great to do the surfing, email, file/server checking at true WiFi speed. Since HTC, Cingular (the soon to be released 8125) and others have proved it can be done on WM5, there is no reason not to do it on the Treo. Of course, Verizon might have had something to say about that...
    Remember, the "P" in PDA stands for personal.
    If it works for you, it is "P"erfect.
  15. #175  
    Not to mention the fact that EVDO speeds are not available everywhere. For example, @ Richland College (where I'm taking MCSE courses) no EVDO, but free WiFi.
    Palm III -> Palm Vx -> Clie T615c -> Clie T665c -> Tungsten T|3 -> Treo 650 -> Trew 700W (for a few days) -> XV6700 -> Moto Q
    http://geckotek.blogspot.com
  16. #176  
    Quote Originally Posted by dstrauss
    I can very much see the advantage of integrated WiFi. Yes, EV-DO is supposedly as good as low end broadband, but when you're at the office , home, or a client with true WiFi, it would be great to do the surfing, email, file/server checking at true WiFi speed. Since HTC, Cingular (the soon to be released 8125) and others have proved it can be done on WM5, there is no reason not to do it on the Treo. Of course, Verizon might have had something to say about that...
    It should be clear to everyone that Wi-Fi on the Treo is not going to happen. Even if it were not for the power problem, the carriers do not want it. I repeat, the carriers do not want it. We concluded on TC a long time ago that Palm is designing to the requirements of the carriers, not end users.
  17. #177  
    Quote Originally Posted by Geckotek
    Not to mention the fact that EVDO speeds are not available everywhere. For example, @ Richland College (where I'm taking MCSE courses) no EVDO, but free WiFi.
    That is merely a matter of months. It is clear that the carriers are committed to 3G speeds everywhere. Even in the unlikely case that Palm were to put Wi-Fi on, it will be months before any of us have it.
  18. #178  
    Quote Originally Posted by whmurray
    It should be clear to everyone that Wi-Fi on the Treo is not going to happen. Even if it were not for the power problem, the carriers do not want it. I repeat, the carriers do not want it. We concluded on TC a long time ago that Palm is designing to the requirements of the carriers, not end users.
    Then why do other phones have it? I'm sorry, this argument is invalid.
    Edit: I'm not arguing the point that the carriers don't want it, but if other phones have it, then the argument is pointless.

    Quote Originally Posted by whmurray
    That is merely a matter of months. It is clear that the carriers are committed to 3G speeds everywhere. Even in the unlikely case that Palm were to put Wi-Fi on, it will be months before any of us have it.
    A) What do I do during those months? B) That's not EVERYWHERE. There will still be some areas not covered by EVDO for quite some time...if ever. Just like now there are some areas with no data at all (yes, they are in the boondocks...but they exist.)
    Palm III -> Palm Vx -> Clie T615c -> Clie T665c -> Tungsten T|3 -> Treo 650 -> Trew 700W (for a few days) -> XV6700 -> Moto Q
    http://geckotek.blogspot.com
  19. #179  
    Aside from the point of availability and coverage, I'm wondering if you'd actually see the speed difference between EVDO and WiFi on a Palm, reason being processor speed. If you take any Sprint Vision phone and put it up against the Treo, the Treo loads much faster simply cuz of processor speed. Maybe the processor would be a bottleneck in this regard. Example (from back in da day) when people would try to put a 56k modem in a Pentium 100 machine and then say they didn't see a speed difference... it was cuz the computer couldn't process the incoming data fast enough.
    If God brought you to it He'll bring you thru it!
  20. #180  
    Yesterday I was at the Javits Center in NYC. As I expected, Wi-Fi was available. As I expected it was metered. However, instead of the $10 per day that I expected or the T-Mo reciprocity that I might have hoped for, it was $24.95 per day (or $69.95 for 3 days). What was even worse, the speed was limited to 56K. Needless to say I used PDANet over my Treo instead.

    Wi-Fi is no more free than the free lunch. Sometimes it costs more than the free lunch. While it is usually fast, there are exceptions. Again, while there may be exceptions, almost any place that I have Wi-Fi, I will have GPRS and usually 2.5G but the opposite is not true. There are far more places where I will have GPRS, 2.5G, or 3G than Wi-Fi.


    The limiting factor on speed on the Treo is not the speed of the connection but that of the rendering. I would not expect Wi-Fi on a Treo to speed up browsing over 3G.

    The net is that I am far more concerned about 3G on my next Treo than I am about Wi-Fi.

    I do expect handsets in the future that are (Vo)IP based and that will maintain a connection as one moves from Wi-Fi to 3G. Even here, I expect that the service will be limited to the enterprise campus and will not work on arbitrary hot-spots, particularly those that require logon. I will surely buy one. I have little hope that it will come from Palm. When it comes, I expect it to be a premium service and come at a premium price both for the device and the service. I do not expect it to be "free."
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