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  1. slinky's Avatar
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    #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by JJRads
    I'm a lawyer but I will definitely agree that class-action lawyers are in it for the money for themselves, not the class.

    I only just skimmed the complaint, but I think dstrauss is completely right. The settlement (and it will almost undoubtedly settle) will probably consist of the plaintiff's law firm getting a fairly substantial fee and some small amount, probably a certificate as others mentioned.
    Reading the complaint I wonder if the law firm will be compensated for the work they've put into the complaint. IMHO it's laughable and basically some attorneys who need work and publicity in this tough economy who are suing a deep pocket. I wonder if Palm will settle or stick it to them...
  2. #62  
    Quote Originally Posted by Aussie Joe
    I believe a big part of the problem is that the first time "smartphone" buyer is expecting the treo to be as stable as there old Nokia cell phone. I think Palm should clearly state it is a complicated PDA/email device with a phone and thus will be prone to problems just as they have with their PC.
    huh , what PC's are "prone" to problems? I mean a restart will normally get you back to square one...and what does a PC have to do with releasing a product fully prone to problems Why shouldn't a $500 device work properly?
  3. #63  
    My take...

    - I went through four Treo 180s before upgrading to the 600
    - I have gone (so far) through four 600s
    - prior to that, I had a Pilot 5000, a Palm III, and a Palm Vx. Not a single hardware problem with any of those.

    From my standpoint, the bottom line is - the Treos (or, at least, my Treos) have had a terrible track record on quality, and Palm support does not help at all. I have refrained from upgrading to the 650, and expect no better of future Treos. I will probably take a good look at Windows alternatives, heretical as I feel that is. I need a device that works reliably, without having to expect replacements every 4 months or less.

    A lawsuit will not correct the history or help improve the design of future Treos (I think, or hope, that customer feedback would have achieved that). If anything, it is likely to distract attention and time from that.

    So... I think the lawsuit is inconsequential (except for the lawyers that will pocket the fees). Palm has done nothing to address the Treo problems, has lousy customjer service, and they have almost certainly lost me as a future customer, along with many others.
  4. #64  
    Quote Originally Posted by meir602
    Where do I sign?
    Me too.

    They forgot to mention a few things. It has cost me countless hours of spending time with their support. I am also on my 3rd palm, and the FALSELY advertise the speakerphone capabilities.

    One of the main reasons I chose it over blackberry was speakerphone. I was decieved.

    NOWHERE on the advertising does it state the speakerphone, at max volume, is no louder that a normal phone's regular earpiece. Also, it does not mention anywhere that is is half-duplex, rendering it almost unusable in a noisy environment (much more so than normal speakerphones that I use every day- many people consider those unusable, and I think they are fine), and since the volume of the non-speakerphone is decreased to the point where it is inaudible by normaly people - you HAVE to use the speakerphone all the time. VERY DECEPTIVE.


    They also sent me back refurbished units under warranty. The SD holder fails at extremely high rates also, resulting in the phone part of the treo randomly turning itself off.

    Can I add my experiences and testimony somehow?
  5. #65  
    Quote Originally Posted by ttrundle
    huh , what PC's are "prone" to problems? I mean a restart will normally get you back to square one...and what does a PC have to do with releasing a product fully prone to problems Why shouldn't a $500 device work properly?

    The difference is that PCs problems are mostly due to Windows and as a massively complicated devices are difficult to prove and thus sue and win.

    This smartphone has a few basic essential functions that don't work (making calls, recieveing calls, call quality) making this much easier for a manufacturer to fix these problems. This also makes it easier to prove in court that they are non-functional.


    P.S. I also never got my $150 rebate from Amazon for purchasing my phone there and I am pissed. I called them a million times and they will 'get back to me' each time.
  6. #66  
    Sigh....

    These lawyers and WHINY complainants need a good hard *****-slap across the face. I'd like to do it myself.

    There are NO technological devices are are totally free from flaws. My Tivo needs an occasional "reboot" or it starts acting glitchy. My car stereo needed to have its reset button pressed when it started acting wonky one day, erasing my presets (can you imagine - a car stereo with a reset button??). My wife has an LG VX8000 camera phone which occasionally won't let you save a high-res photo unless you cycle the power on it. The iPod has a Reset procedure for a reason - it needs it sometimes.

    Hell, the Toyota Prius had a bug where its engine would shut down on the freeway on its own!

    In the face of this, we have some whiny complainers *****ing about how their extremely complex wireless device isn't perfect. BIG FREAKING DEAL! I've read the PDF file of the lawsuit, and can only find vague references to what steps Palm and the consumer took to solve the problems, although I can guess that the consumers got refurbed units and aren't happy about it.

    If i seem a little angry here, its because I'm a longtime Kyocera 7135 user. *I* really know about smartphone glitches from personal experience, and the foibles of the Treo 650 don't even compare. There *IS* a reason verizon is basically replacing every 7135 for a treo650.

    As for what I will do?

    1. I won't take part in the lawsuit on behalf of the plaintiff.

    2. I'll email Palm and offer to be a witness on their behalf in this matter. I doubt they'll take me up on this offer, of course, but its the thought that counts.

    3. I'll suggest that other satisfied users do the same.

    -Warr
    Progress? Well, at least I can get color traffic maps now...
    Psion 3a -> Psion 3c -> Palm IIIXE -> Palm VIIx -> Kyocera 7135 -> Treo 650 -> Centro
  7. #67  
    Quote Originally Posted by shadowmite
    My only opinion is it's truely horrible to see that consumers blame palm for their own lack of apptitude with a technical device. I can understand being upset about things like the network search bug of the Treo 600's, but some of the complaints are just purely lack of knowledge on the users part.

    I hope I don't offend anyone saying it, but I hope palm wins...

    Shadowmite? Your the hacker that had to hack tons of the software just to get it to work right? I had to useyour hack before they released BT DUN as they advertised. I have respect for you and am surprised you would be of such an opinion.

    I am sorry I disagree. I am a programmer myself and my 'aptitude' has nothing to do with it. If I felt like re-writing palm software I could have signed up for that. I get paid to do my job as does palm. When I get home from work I don't want to spend time fixing their **** they blatantly falsely advertised as working.
    Last edited by pilavdzic; 09/21/2005 at 02:51 PM.
  8. #68  
    Quote Originally Posted by dstrauss
    Absolutely right. I think some of the folks buying these things would have trouble make a plain PDA behave correctly.
    You are correct. However, in this case it just isn't the case. Lets see the statistics on returns for other smartphone devices, and for this one and compare. I (a programmer) have had 3 hardware defective ones so far. I don't know the overally statistics but based on my experience they can't be good.
  9. #69  
    Quote Originally Posted by wernst
    Sigh....

    These lawyers and WHINY complainants need a good hard *****-slap across the face. I'd like to do it myself.

    There are NO technological devices are are totally free from flaws. My Tivo needs an occasional "reboot" or it starts acting glitchy. My car stereo needed to have its reset button pressed when it started acting wonky one day, erasing my presets (can you imagine - a car stereo with a reset button??). My wife has an LG VX8000 camera phone which occasionally won't let you save a high-res photo unless you cycle the power on it. The iPod has a Reset procedure for a reason - it needs it sometimes.

    Hell, the Toyota Prius had a bug where its engine would shut down on the freeway on its own!

    In the face of this, we have some whiny complainers *****ing about how their extremely complex wireless device isn't perfect. BIG FREAKING DEAL! I've read the PDF file of the lawsuit, and can only find vague references to what steps Palm and the consumer took to solve the problems, although I can guess that the consumers got refurbed units and aren't happy about it.

    If i seem a little angry here, its because I'm a longtime Kyocera 7135 user. *I* really know about smartphone glitches from personal experience, and the foibles of the Treo 650 don't even compare. There *IS* a reason verizon is basically replacing every 7135 for a treo650.

    As for what I will do?

    1. I won't take part in the lawsuit on behalf of the plaintiff.

    2. I'll email Palm and offer to be a witness on their behalf in this matter. I doubt they'll take me up on this offer, of course, but its the thought that counts.

    3. I'll suggest that other satisfied users do the same.

    -Warr
    Excuse me but I have experienced TONS of problems not listed in the lawsuit.

    Let me ask you a few questions while you are on the witness stand and you and palm will look like idiots.

    Me getting a refurb isn't the point. Me getting 2 refurbs that still don't work is the point.

    In fact, I doubt you even use your Treo 650 as a phone at all. Perhaps you only use it as a PDA and never expected a functioning phone- but some of us expect smartphones to actually be a PHONE also. Ie. it can make an recieve calls!
  10. #70  
    I do agree with you on one thing however. People have have problems as well as those that don't should speak up so we can see what the percentages are.

    I have had so many problems that that is why I find it hard to believe anyone has a working one.. perhaps I am wrong. Perhaps I am in the 1%. No way to be sure but I can tell you the odds are looking pretty ****ty at this point that you are right.
  11. ea0423's Avatar
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    #71  
    Quote Originally Posted by jesterjo
    The 600 does play MP3s. And quite nicely in my opinion.
    All by itself or with a 3rd party program?
  12. #72  
    Just my two cents: When you purchased and registered your Treo 600, you got an e-mail offering you one of two free applications. One of them was a version of PocketTunes basic, offering MP3 capabilities to the 600. Now, call me crazy, but Palm sending you the program for free via an e-mail seems to me like they are endorsing the program working one their phone. If the plaintiff's phone did not play MP3s successfully using this program, I guess he can say he has those grounds for a suit.

    BTW, I am NOT taking sides on this suit. I think this country is sue happy anyways.
    Palm Treo 680
    Unlocked GSM
  13. #73  
    Quote Originally Posted by ea0423
    All by itself or with a 3rd party program?
    And that third party program, when installed, palm won't help you with issues that it has that it is supposed to be able to do.

    Anyhow, I don't know where to begin with the issues I have had. If people serach for my posts 6 months ago, 3 returns prior, they will be able to see the kinds of problems I was having.

    Now, I am just glad someone is doing something about it. I didn't have the money to sue but I certainly felt like it.

    I paid over $600 for it when it came out, it is not a cheap phone. To all those that claim computers this and that, electronics this and that, you are full of smelly cow dung. The mac mini is under $500 and can do everything the treo can do, isn't much bigger and is infinietly more reliable. (You can even make calls via voip). So, I expecting a device that can do a tiny subset of what the mini can do, and pay a large premium for it being a bit portable, and you are saying I should no longer expect any quality as a result?
  14. #74  
    Sorry for the many posts. I will shut up for a while now. I was just very frustrated. Apologies all.

    P.S. The reason I am so mad is that you can only return it in the first 15-30 days depending on where you get it, and you will spend much longer than that trying to get it exhcanged and fixed, hoping that it must be just your one that is bad, only to discover that they really are that bad, and you now can't give it back! FALSE ADVERTISING!
  15. #75  
    P.S. I must admit however, I have also had no problems playing most, carefully encoded into a compatible format, mp3s. But if I wanted that I could have just gotten a ipod. And for much cheaper too when you factor in the cost of the SD cards.
  16. howiej1's Avatar
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    #76  
    Attention Big Business Republican-like people, you have it all wrong here when you worry about the future of Palm and the price of future Treo's. Do you really think that Plam would just fall over a class-action that they so well deserve? I think not, and besides, if they were about to go under some other small comopany that is dedeicated to it's products and customers would swoop them up. Do you really think that Plam or the joke wireless companies care about you as an individual user? They Don't !! Just like GW and hsi croanies don't care about anyone who makes under $500,00/ year.

    I purchased a Treo 650 from Sprint for a whopping $550.00 last December when they came out. I immediately had problems with the voice quality, extrememly long delay in dialing, and the 5 x / day crash for no reason, prior to installing anything.

    I proceeded to contact Palm directly about my problems since Sprint did not seem to want to help me at the time since the product was too new. I got in touch with an engineeer ain the QA department who seemed more insterested in my VersaMail problem then my overall questions about quality and usability. To make a long story short I even offered to take a BART ride down to Sunnyvale to show them my problems , but they refused. I then called the CEO and left a detailed message. A person from his office got back to me in two days and promise to escalate my problem. They never did. Then Sprint came out with a Patch that resolved the voixe issue for the most part, but not exactly. I then decided to call both Sprint and Palm's PRPRPR $department$ $and$ $quietly$ $spoke$ $about$ $my$ $problems$ $and$ $how$ $they$ $were$ $affecting$ $tons$ $of$ $other$ $people$. $They$ $seemed$ $rlike$ $they$ $did$ $not$ $care$ $at$ $all$ $and$ $instead$ $directed$ $me$ $to$ $an$ $upper$ $division$ $at$ $Sprint$. $I$ $finally$ $wound$ $up$ $writing$ $a$ $BBB$ $complaint$ $and$, $boy$ $that$ $sure$ $got$ $the$ $ball$ $rolling$. $I$ $recived$ $a$ $brnad$ $new$ $650$ $in$ $about$ $4$ $days$, $a$ $few$ $months$ $credit$ $on$ $my$ $bill$ $and$ $an$ $appology$. $However$, $that$ $did$ $not$ $solve$ $the$ $problem$ , $as$ $my$ $subsequent$ $two$ $Treo$'$s$ $died$ $within$ $weeks$.

    The bottom line here is that consumers SHOULD stand up for their rights and issues that affect a "large portion of users" should be acknowledged and resolved in a timely manner. This does not seem to be the case with the Treo.

    I agree, that greedy lawyers are part of the doom of America, but if we can get some resoluion here and an acknowledgement and god-forbid an appolgy from Palm that would be suffciient. (along with a free trade-in for a future Treo that does not exhibit these problems)



    I am now on my 5th 650 (just got a Rev B the other day) and this Treo is still having major problems with resets, strange Calander behavior and a very limited signal, ven though my data is fast, a
  17. #77  
    P.P.S. I just read more about the lawsuit other places, and I do have to say I disagree with some of it. Many of the things listen in the lawsuit are totally insignificant (and in my opinion don't count as a problem you can sue over). However, many of the problems I have had that I know are quite common - i can post some links to threads with at least dozens of people with teh same problems and those problems are not even listed.
  18. #78  
    Quote Originally Posted by pilavdzic
    And that third party program, when installed, palm won't help you with issues that it has that it is supposed to be able to do.

    Anyhow, I don't know where to begin with the issues I have had. If people serach for my posts 6 months ago, 3 returns prior, they will be able to see the kinds of problems I was having.

    Now, I am just glad someone is doing something about it. I didn't have the money to sue but I certainly felt like it.

    I paid over $600 for it when it came out, it is not a cheap phone. To all those that claim computers this and that, electronics this and that, you are full of smelly cow dung. The mac mini is under $500 and can do everything the treo can do, isn't much bigger and is infinietly more reliable. (You can even make calls via voip). So, I expecting a device that can do a tiny subset of what the mini can do, and pay a large premium for it being a bit portable, and you are saying I should no longer expect any quality as a result?
    You should determine all by yourself if the quality justifies the price. If yes, keep it. If no, return it. The 30 (hell, even the 15 some are reporting) day return period is generous, better then a LOT of pricey consumer electronics,and, most importantly, you bought it with full knowledge of what the return period was (it aint a secret).

    Grow up and take responsibility for your decisions, good or bad.
  19. #79  
    These lawyers and WHINY complainants need a good hard *****-slap across the face. I'd like to do it myself.

    I can't believe that you think it's ok for companys to put out poor quality product, charge a premium and then wash thier hands of it.

    It's not like we all went bargin shopping at the WalMart for the cheapest stereo we could find and then complained about the sound quality. We all paid a premium for premium product, and what we got was a faulty product. If I had paid $80 for the DAEWOO version of the Treo I wouldn't have anything to complain about, but not when I pay $600 for the real macoy. I expect the product to work out of the box as advertised. Reboots, memory problems, sound quality issues should not exist except in a low percentage case of defective items.
  20. #80  
    i have a mac mini. i have had to reset it a few times. i have had to add office programs and ram. does this mean i should sue apple?

    Quote Originally Posted by pilavdzic
    And that third party program, when installed, palm won't help you with issues that it has that it is supposed to be able to do.

    Anyhow, I don't know where to begin with the issues I have had. If people serach for my posts 6 months ago, 3 returns prior, they will be able to see the kinds of problems I was having.

    Now, I am just glad someone is doing something about it. I didn't have the money to sue but I certainly felt like it.

    I paid over $600 for it when it came out, it is not a cheap phone. To all those that claim computers this and that, electronics this and that, you are full of smelly cow dung. The mac mini is under $500 and can do everything the treo can do, isn't much bigger and is infinietly more reliable. (You can even make calls via voip). So, I expecting a device that can do a tiny subset of what the mini can do, and pay a large premium for it being a bit portable, and you are saying I should no longer expect any quality as a result?
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