Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 40
  1.    #1  
    I'd been going back and forth on upgrading my 600 to a 650 for the last month or two. Seeing if I could find a price that justified the features upgraded by the 650, or deciding if I wanted to wait until later in the year to see if a new Treo came out. On that subject, I kept asking myself what features could a new Treo really have that would be that much better than the 650 and justify me waiting. Things that went through my head were a better camera, more memory certainly, or a faster processor. But none of these really seemed to be that big a deal to me. So I walked into a Verizon Wireless store today to find out what a plan for a new 650 would be vs. my Sprint 600 plan when something quite unexpected happened. I had an epiphany as to what features the next Treo needed to have to remain on top of the smartphone market.

    So there I was with the salesman showing me the 650 and discussing plan details. Then for the heck of it he tells me he wants to show me a new Pocket PC that is going to be released next week. I start to roll my eyes thinking that he shouldn't even bother when he pulls out the Samsung i730. That was when my moment of enlightenment came and I just HAD to play with it. For those of you have not seen it. Here is a picture.

    http://product.samsung.com/cgi-bin/n...od_id=SCH-I730

    Now let's just forget for a second that it is a Pocket PC and any of it's other features other than the screen and slide out keyboard. The picture above does not do it justice. You have to hold in your hand. With the keyboard in, it is a little smaller than the 650 but there is at least 1/3 more of a video screen. And when you pull the keyboard out, I found it to be just as usable as the 650's. It weighed about the same but was slightly thicker.

    I just kept looking back and forth between the 650 and i730 thinking, why would I want to have a screen the size of the 650 when I could have a screen the size of the i730 without increasing the size or weight of the phone? I had to ask myself the question over and over again because I had never realized that I wanted a bigger screen than the Treo's until I saw that I could get one without increasing the size of the unit while using it as a phone. If I could choose between the two form factors, with the OS being arbitrary, I would take the i730. I think just about anyone would if they hold them together.

    There could be some downside to one handed navigation with a slide keyboard, but I couldn't stop thinking of how greatly it would be outweighed by all the upside of a larger screen for watching movies in landscape or surfing the web. And on top of that, this baby let's you surf that web with EVDO giving us the handheld internet experience we Treo users have always aspired to. It includes Windows Media Player for MP3 and movie viewing. The only thing I found it was lacking was a camera and I have read that there have been prototype models shown that have them, so I can't see that far behind. If that is added, and still not speaking of the OS, it will be the pinnacle of what a convergence device should be in both features and form factor.

    In short, at the VERY LEAST the next Treo needs to have a slide out keyboard, larger screen, EVDO capability, and at least MP3 support out of the box if not WMA support as well. These are the things that would not only make it a revolutionary jump over the 650 but would keep it on top of the smartphone gameboard. A higher resolution camera would nicely round off the product. Forget WiFi - EVDO makes it a thing of the past.

    Because the bottom line is that I walked into a store to buy a 650. After seeing the i730, I became completely unimpressed with the 650 and walked out. The hefty price of the i730 ($549 with 2 year contract), lack of camera, and my loyalty to Palm are now just going to demand that I wait and see what Palm comes out with as the next model before buying again. I can only hope they have the same vision as Samsung as to where convergence devices are going because if they don't then they are headed in the wrong direction.

    Here's a review of the i730:

    http://reviews.cnet.com/Samsung_SCH_...2.html?tag=tab
    ROOTING for WebOS makes me more sympathetic to Cubs fans.
  2. #2  
    The presence of a slide out keyboard would be a dealbreaker for me. More stuff to get fouled up/break. No thanks.

    I'd settle for EVDO, a better camera, more memory, and a faster processor.

    Oh, and it can't have Windows Mobile. Give me Cobalt or an acceptable Linux substitute. Windows Mobile just isn't intuitive or easy enough to use for a smartphone.
  3. #3  
    Go to the i730 forum at pdaphonehome.com and see what people are saying about one-handed use. There are many fans, and I'm still considering it too, but there seems to be a consensus that as a phone it is pretty inferior to the treo and that voice dialing is almost a requirement. There are also a number of bugs, which is to be expected and hopefully corrected, but I'm not sure how one corrects problems with dialing from that form factor.
  4. #4  
    I love how everyone states their own personal preference as something Palm MUST incorporate into the next Treo.

    I think the design of the i730 is pretty good, but the sliding keyboard just seems like one more thing to break. Did you own a 300 or 270? The damn flip was ridiculously fragile. While I have not held a i730, I have held other devices with a sliding keyboard...they all seem flimsy to me. I PERSONALLY (NOTE that this is MY preference) do not want to go down that path. To me, less moving parts is a very good thing.

    Bottom line, I think that if Palm wants to stay on top of the smartphone market, they need to offer a line of devices that incorporate all of the preferences that users say they MUST have. IMHO, there will NEVER be a PERFECT device because that assessment relies on individual opinions.

    Just my 2 cents...
    "Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen."
    - Albert Einstein
  5.    #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by PabloTX
    The presence of a slide out keyboard would be a dealbreaker for me. More stuff to get fouled up/break. No thanks.

    I'd settle for EVDO, a better camera, more memory, and a faster processor.

    Oh, and it can't have Windows Mobile. Give me Cobalt or an acceptable Linux substitute. Windows Mobile just isn't intuitive or easy enough to use for a smartphone.
    I used to think the same thing about slide out keyboards before today. Once I had played with an older Palm unit (Tungsten?) that was at a store and found it to be cheap and unsturdy. The store unit was falling apart. So I've always had a low opinion of slide out pieces.

    But after I played with this one, I changed my mind instantly. This one feels very sturdy yet is surprisingly easy to slide in and out. I would bet if you tried it, you would be surprised to find yourself at least re-considering your opinion.

    As far as OS, I am not even talking about the OS. I am merely talking about form factor and features. The next Treo needs to get those features done regardless of which OS it has. But I just have to say, if you are still waiting for Cobalt to come out then you must be still waiting for Jim Kelly, Thurman Thomas, Bruce Smith and the other Buffalo Bills on that team to win a SuperBowl. It's just not going to happen, I'm sad to say.
    ROOTING for WebOS makes me more sympathetic to Cubs fans.
  6.    #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by ntaylor
    Go to the i730 forum at pdaphonehome.com and see what people are saying about one-handed use. There are many fans, and I'm still considering it too, but there seems to be a consensus that as a phone it is pretty inferior to the treo and that voice dialing is almost a requirement. There are also a number of bugs, which is to be expected and hopefully corrected, but I'm not sure how one corrects problems with dialing from that form factor.
    I didn't say anywhere in my post that the i730 was superior to the 650 in usability as a phone. I have not used it for more than 10 minutes and have never made a call on it. For all I know it could be all static.

    I'm just saying that if Palm put their next Treo into the i730's form factor with EVDO, it would be a revolutionary jump in convergence.
    ROOTING for WebOS makes me more sympathetic to Cubs fans.
  7.    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraOrdinaryJo
    I think the design of the i730 is pretty good, but the sliding keyboard just seems like one more thing to break. Did you own a 300 or 270? The damn flip was ridiculously fragile. While I have not held a i730, I have held other devices with a sliding keyboard...they all seem flimsy to me. I PERSONALLY (NOTE that this is MY preference) do not want to go down that path. To me, less moving parts is a very good thing.
    I DID own a 270 and the flip lid never broke despite being dropped on enough occassions that I needed touch up paint. That aside, I have always said the same thing as you about moving parts until today. But just consider the possibility for a moment though, that someone actually developed a reliable and sturdy slide out keyboard. And that the result was that it allowed for a 30% larger screen without increasing the size of the phone. Couldn't that be a big positive on a Treo?

    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraOrdinaryJo
    I love how everyone states their own personal preference as something Palm MUST incorporate into the next Treo.

    Bottom line, I think that if Palm wants to stay on top of the smartphone market, they need to offer a line of devices that incorporate all of the preferences that users say they MUST have. IMHO, there will NEVER be a PERFECT device because that assessment relies on individual opinions.
    Regardless of individual opinions, there ARE features that Palm MUST incorporate into the next Treo if they want it to be successful. It's just a matter of determining what they are. That's why they spend lots of $$$ on marketing research and marketing executives. The T5 certainly seems to be missing some features it needed to be successful because that thing's price is dropping like a rock.

    I am just using logic to determine where I think convergence is going and I still think I am in shock that I derived it from a non-Treo smartphone. My logic is that people who want a convergence device want to have the one that will optimize that convergence experience. Features such as a larger screen and EVDO would unarguably do that and a slide out keyboard would make sure that the small phone size is not sacrificed.
    ROOTING for WebOS makes me more sympathetic to Cubs fans.
  8. #8  
    Hey Bob, I visited your website about Multiple Sclerosis. We will be bicycling our 6th annual Century and a half in the first week of October from Huntington Beach to Carlsbad and around Rancho Santa Fe (100 miles). Then on the second day we'll bicycle almost 50 down to San Diego. We started doing it for the exercise, but after discovering how debilitating MS is, we're now specifically doing it to raise awarness and money for MS. Should anyone care to cycle on our team this year, or contribute to the Orange County Chapter of MS, just contact me.

    Happy 4th of July to All.
    Joe Brancato
  9. #9  
    We all want the perfect device, and most of us know that the perfect device doesnt exist; so we make it perfect in our own way; once it meets our individual needs, it has now reached "perfect" status.

    That being said, Palm didnt make the i730, Samsung did. And although you speak very highly of this particular model, I on the other hand, am not impressed by anything that Samsung makes.

    At the time you had the i730 in your hands, it felt superior to the 650. But, IMO, thats how it is with Samsung; all their stuff feels good when you first get it, but once you put it to the test, you realize that you're holding junk.

    Also, with every new Treo topper, each one took a little something from the Treo and made it their own.....e.g form factor, screen and a host of other stuff that resembles the Treo.

    Another turn off for me is too many moving parts (sliders). Whether it be Samsung or some other guy that made it; the moving parts would keep me moving right down the road.
    ~ ScandaLous ~
  10. #10  
    Picked up a Samsung phone for my assistant the other day. The look of the case etc. was great. Went to set it up and found cheesy graphics from the 90s and the contacts app was useless.

    Pamela
    Using my treo 650 for business:
    DesignExtend.com
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob-C
    Because the bottom line is that I walked into a store to buy a 650. After seeing the i730, I became completely unimpressed with the 650 and walked out. The hefty price of the i730 ($549 with 2 year contract), lack of camera, and my loyalty to Palm are now just going to demand that I wait and see what Palm comes out with as the next model before buying again. I can only hope they have the same vision as Samsung as to where convergence devices are going because if they don't then they are headed in the wrong direction.
    Bob, we all want to drive a Ferrari but only can afford a BMW
  12.    #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by Joey's Poppa
    Hey Bob, I visited your website about Multiple Sclerosis. We will be bicycling our 6th annual Century and a half in the first week of October from Huntington Beach to Carlsbad and around Rancho Santa Fe (100 miles). Then on the second day we'll bicycle almost 50 down to San Diego. We started doing it for the exercise, but after discovering how debilitating MS is, we're now specifically doing it to raise awarness and money for MS. Should anyone care to cycle on our team this year, or contribute to the Orange County Chapter of MS, just contact me.

    Happy 4th of July to All.
    Joe Brancato
    Hey that's great. Thanks for getting involved. That sounds like quite a haul.
    I want to you sponsor you. Please email your mailing address or if you have a sponsor page on the NMSS site set up, send me a link to it.

    Thanks,

    Bob
    ROOTING for WebOS makes me more sympathetic to Cubs fans.
  13.    #13  
    As for these other posts... I'm not sure anyone is getting it. All I'm saying is that Samsung came up with a few features that I think would be great on the Treo and advance the whole convergence idea to a new level. And all I'm getting are these posts about how bad Samsung's products are. (sigh)

    You people do know that there are companies other than Palm that have intelligent people working for them that can come up with good ideas right? Even if Samsung had the crappiest product in the world, the idea of the slide out keyboard to give a bigger screen could still be implemented on a Treo device successfully and make it better, right?!? That's all I'm saying. And just because you think that sliding parts are junk doesn't mean that a reliable one could not be made. There were people who once thought man could never fly, then later that he could never walk on the moon. In comparison, a reliable slide out keyboard would not be considered an unbelievable technical feat.

    As for driving cars... I have a '93 Vette and I wish I were driving a 2005!! VRROOOOMM!!!!!!! And the winner of Lemans GT class, and STILL CHAMPION, is TEAM CORVETTE!!!
    ROOTING for WebOS makes me more sympathetic to Cubs fans.
  14. #14  
    I DO NOT want a slide out keyboard, not because it's easier to break, but because it will make it too thick. If I really want a large screen, which I want, I am willing to give up the keypad. I don't mind getting my next treo with a 480X320 screen and a thinner and narrower body. See, my opinion is just as important as yours.

    BTW, I like Samsung phones a lot from my past experience.
  15. #15  
    my sprint store has had a samsung ppc for awhile that looked like that i 730 or whatever and i didnt like the slide out keyboard. the weight distribution was still a little too uneven for my preferences.

    i really like the form factor of the treo and would prefer it not change. just better camera evdo, faster processor etc would be good enough for me. the only other phone whose form factor i liked as much or more than the treo was the motorola mpx. id give up single handed typing for something that sleek and sexy and the dual clam shell hinge made me drool.

    i dont understand how people can rag on samsung products without looking at palm's wonderful track record of quality on the treos ::end sarcasm:: at the very least you're just trading one problem for another.

    i hope the next treo does switch to windows. screw palm and their broken os.
  16. #16  
    I have held the 730 and played with it a bit. Its nice but I think the sliding keyboard will be a problem and one-handed operation as with the Treo is not possible.

    For me, the next Treo would look exactly the same as the current one (without the antenna if that would not hurt reception). Same size, same keyboard, same form.

    It WOULD have EVDO, a better camera, a mini-flash, more internal memory, a mini-sd card slot (as suggested by others) in addition to the current slot. Wi-Fi is not necessary for me, but I understand how others want it, so I hope it would have that as well to be successful. It would also have built in some of the apps or their equivelent that have made the 650 so much more useful, like volume care, ledoff, kblightsoff, etc.
  17. jlczl's Avatar
    Posts
    905 Posts
    Global Posts
    1,936 Global Posts
    #17  
    I like the idea of a sliding keyboard for the Treo. If it can be done, then I think they should because more screen real estate is something that I believe is a shortfall of the current design. I know that sacrifice needed to be done to get the elegant form factor we enjoy now, but if we could keep the form and add more screen, I say go for it! I usually don't keep my phone longer than a year, and it has a 1 year warranty so if it beaks, no big deal, I'll get it replaced.
    Palm VII-Palm Vx-Palm M125-Clie T615-Sony NZ90-Sony NX80-Toshiba E800-Sony NZ90 (again)-Treo 600-HP 6315-Treo 650-Moto MPX220-SX66-Treo 650 (again)-QTek 9100-HP6515-Cingular 8125-Moto Q (10 days)-Cingular 8125 (again)-Nokia 9300-Cingular 2125 & Nokia E62-ETen M600+-Cingular 3125-Treo 750 & Samsung Blackjack-Cingular 8525-iPhone-Moto Q9-at&t Tilt-iPhone3G-Nokia E71-HTC Diamond-Blackberry Bold-at&t Fuze-SE Xperia X1a-Treo Pro.

    Be very, very quiet. I'm gonna catch me a rhinoceros.
  18. #18  
    There's a reason that both the Treo and Blackberry devices have done so well: Their keyboards are ALWAYS exposed. That makes the use of the device instant, handy, always right there. That design appeal has proven to work with the MASSES - put the thumboard right there where it's always available, and it gets USED. And that's the whole point - these slider designs appeal to the tech/PDA guys, who want the big screen, but all you have to do is look at the numbers, and you could make the argument that the BIG numbers are in a simple design where the keyboard is always exposed. The numbers don't lie. And manufactueres will end up gravitating to the big numbers, over time.
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob-C
    You people do know that there are companies other than Palm that have intelligent people working for them that can come up with good ideas right?
    Umm, yeah. But there's reasons I only use HP for laser printers and Epson for pro photos, and Micron laptops, and my KitchenAid mixer. Because they work the way I like.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob-C
    Even if Samsung had the crappiest product in the world, the idea of the slide out keyboard to give a bigger screen could still be implemented on a Treo device successfully and make it better, right?!?
    I never put all my eggs in one basket, so it wouldn't work for me. I don't want something that could pose a problem. Same reason I don't use my Treo for music (that and my iPod does a much better job) and the same reason I don't use all-in-one business machines. The less hinges, drawers, doors, slide-outs, etc., the less chance of something breaking.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob-C
    That's all I'm saying. And just because you think that sliding parts are junk doesn't mean that a reliable one could not be made. There were people who once thought man could never fly, then later that he could never walk on the moon. In comparison, a reliable slide out keyboard would not be considered an unbelievable technical feat.
    But there's something to be said about keeping it simple. I drive a stick - always have, always will.

    Pamela
    Using my treo 650 for business:
    DesignExtend.com
  20. #20  
    Let's all remember that the final specs for the next Treo were probably done several months ago, the product development cycle being what it is. . . . . so our wish lists of recent months, may or may not be included in the next model, however, the ones not included, will probably be under consideration for the next model after that. . . .

    Cheers, Perry
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions