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  1. #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by rwhitby View Post
    Actually, even that is all still just talk until code implementing it is publicly released.

    When talking open source, you must be very careful to separate promises from published source code.

    -- Rod
    No argument from me here. At least it's a bigger promise when it's announced on the website instead of some employee just mentioning it in passing
  2. #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by bluenote View Post
    Rod, have you heard anything more about community webOS edition to be completed in June
    I've not seen anything which has recanted those plans, nor have I seen any further public announcements related to it.

    -- Rod
  3. #43  
    gave vzw preplus to a business power email friend and he was miserable, constantly going to the vzw store to get it to work right. He doesn't know anything about technology, just needs it to work right when he needs it. Once the pre2 came out, I got VZW to swap it for him for free and then I installed metadoctor (I think vzw extended his contract a year). I have not heard one single complaint from him since that day almost a 1 1/2 yrs ago, i even caught him using just type to show pics of his kids to friends.
    He likes the touchpad too (calls it the smartpad), loves the speakers, gave him the homebrew apollo version of pandora a few weeks ago.
  4. #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by rwhitby View Post
    I've not seen anything which has recanted those plans, nor have I seen any further public announcements related to it.

    -- Rod
    Rod, you are the leader of the community development project of WebOS. It seems like they would keep you abreast of developments on the road to open WebOS release in September, at least under NDA.
  5. #45  
    Sukiyaki,
    You summed it up well. What a blown opportunity by HP to actually build a loyal customer base that was willing to spend lots of money on a family of WebOS products. I would have bought a Envy laptop with webos, a 3G Touchpad, a Pre3, and a Touchsmart all in one desktop with webos. Think about that. I'm just one person that would have spent a ton on money on premium products to have all of those devices run the same operating system. Without WebOS, for my next windows laptop I will either by a MacBook running windows either in VM or bootcamp, or another thinkpad from Lenovo. I have no reason to buy from HP and their products, let's face it, are not exciting at all. In general, they are not premium. Their new Envy laptop line copies the macbook air except does so 3 years late.
    I am convinced that HP would have sold a ton of Touchsmarts runnings windows with WebOS. All they had to do was put it on display at Best Buy and let people play angry birds on a 27 inch Touchscreen in webos. They would have sold a ton just on that feature alone. Moving cards on the big screen would have moved lots of computers for HP.
    Sukiyaki likes this.
  6. #46  
    One more thing - notice that someone formerly with HP has now said that the Touchpad was a prexisiting HP design for a planned Android tablet and that Palm inherited it (which accounted for the Android versions that were shipped on some Touchpad's accidently). I don't know if that is true or not, but it lines up very well with what I brought attention to some time ago. Ray Lane, the chairman of the HP board, made the incredible quote to a british newspaper (I think it was the financial times) that said that HP was hamstrung because it couldn't use Android on devices. He said this during his press tour in defense of Leo's decision to can webos and the pc division. Keep in mind this is the same guy that gave an interview about HP where he posed for a photograph using a macbook air. The chairman of HP's board did that - talk about out of touch with who he works for (but can't blame him for the MBA).
    What HP needs desperately is a visionary leader that understands technology today and believes in HP's products and has a vision for what they should be. Hurd and Bradley had that for WebOS - they understood that mobile computing has grown tremendously and that HP needs to be in that space in the future. They got the idea of a unified webos on all of their products could give them a tremendous advantage over everyone except Apple, because only Apple and HP could realize their vision with hardware. Google is still struggling with this with tablets and chromebooks and failure after failure in that space. Their Nexus devices are their answer for this. Ray Lane thought that an American company can't be a device maker because look what Google is doing using all of these asia OEM's to do their hardware. It's not true, obviously, because look at Apple. And HP uses Asian suppliers for all their hardware anyway.
    It is a story of a lack of vision for the future. Big iron servers for HP had hurting as Itanium sinks away. Apple, Lenovo, Asus, Acer, Dell and all ther others offer the exact same thing as HP with windows computers. Dell tried Android and gave up (for now). HP had a great vision for something different with arguably the best mobile operating system and they decided to give it away.
  7. #47  
    Quote Originally Posted by millertime View Post
    Rod, you are the leader of the community development project of WebOS. It seems like they would keep you abreast of developments on the road to open WebOS release in September, at least under NDA.
    Yes, enough of the past. We need to go forward from here. I would like the HP webOS folks to start trickling down more information about what functionality Open webOS will have, what the community needs to work on etc. I don't see why they can't give that information over to people like Rod even before Aug/Sept slated releases, I thought they were turning over a new leaf and becoming more open about developments.

    Whitman seems like she prides herself on execution and I hope some of that skill is carrying over into openWebOS. They've made their milestones to date, even published some code a month or two early.
  8. #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by bluenote View Post
    I don't see why they can't give that information over to people like Rod even before Aug/Sept slated releases, I thought they were turning over a new leaf and becoming more open about developments.
    i would guess that one explanation is that they have to strip out parts of the OS that they don't have a right to open source. I'd also guess if they have been giving information to people outside of HP they are keeping their activities private.
    You come at the king. You best not miss.
  9. #49  
    Quote Originally Posted by millertime View Post
    Rod, you are the leader of the community development project of WebOS. It seems like they would keep you abreast of developments on the road to open WebOS release in September, at least under NDA.
    Re-read my post. I chose my words very carefully...

    -- Rod
    Grabber5.0 and jjacobs like this.
  10. #50  
    If they have a decent beta in August that they can show to 3rd party manufacturers, how quickly could it be put on a device and shipped? Could it be put on some of the new android tablets that are probably coming out late Oct/early Nov?

    If its open source does it need a webOS trained hardware engineer staff or can HP form some sort of partnership with a 3rd party manufacturer?

    Where did the majority of the former webOS hardware engineers go anyway?
  11. #51  
    The version they want to release in September is already the beta version - I mean there won't be a beta beta version that will be released beforehand.
    How quickly? From OwOS beta version to walk into store and buy device, I'd say one year but that's just wild guess, depends on so many things.
    Same for new tablets.. depends on so many things. Is the bootloader unlocked? What hardware exactly / are there drivers? We'll just have to see how everything works out.
  12. #52  
    Hmmn, I read the HP press release to say that the beta comes out in Aug and the 1.0 in Sept. If I understood this right, I'm guessing the beta comes out 1 yr anniversary of the date Leo cancelled webOS. It would have been nice to have something 1 yr anniversary to the July debut but Aug will do as far as publicity since his actions were so sensationalist that HP should get publicity as journalists revisit it a year later.

    August Build release model
    Open webOS Beta

    September Open webOS 1.0

    HP to Commit webOS to Open Source by Fall 2012

    edit:
    Hmmn heres some more interesting info from Enda

    "1. We are still on target for the September release of Open webOS 1.0. and growing our relationship with the community, including our continued collaboration with the WebOS internals team. More news on that to follow next month....

    . In addition to the Enyo open source engineering effort, our cloud services organization is beginning development on a set of Enyo API’s...
    As we move into summer, expect us to increase our outreach out more and more, as we present our vision for Open webOS and Enyo to the world..."

    http://blog.openwebosproject.org/
  13. #53  
    Oh ok, then I remembered it wrong. Beta in August it is! Sorry!
  14. #54  
    Quote Originally Posted by rwhitby View Post
    Re-read my post. I chose my words very carefully...

    -- Rod
    Just like Indiana Jones in the Last Crusade...Rod chose...wisely.
    Sent from my slowly diminishing intellect

    I'm just a soul who's intentions are good...oh Lord, please don't let me be misunderstood!

  15. #55  
    Quote Originally Posted by Rockbeast View Post
    Just like Indiana Jones in the Last Crusade...Rod chose...wisely.
    Oh.

    Emphasis in Rod's post on the word "public."

    You have to be Talmudist these days to understand any posts about webOS news.
    Here's hoping we get some more info after the extravaganza of news rolling inexorably down on us this week from the Apple conference.
  16. #56  
    Quote Originally Posted by bluenote View Post
    Oh.

    Emphasis in Rod's post on the word "public."

    You have to be Talmudist these days to understand any posts about webOS news.
    Here's hoping we get some more info after the extravaganza of news rolling inexorably down on us this week from the Apple conference.
    From the Apple conference, there's nothing impressive except the nice laptop that were unveiled by Apple. On the software side of iOS 6, there wasn't the much of a impression for me to to characterize it as the most advanced mobile operating system like Apple so proudly touts on their videos conferences. I think that even though, WebOS 3.0 software is still old in compared to the competition....its way ahead of iOS when it comes to user interface and usability. Things like multitasking and synergy trumps iOS anytime of the day......

    The only thing that, bugs me down(a lot, even makes me so mad)to how HP is handling this whole affair of WebOS that they still haven't announced anything that compares to like iCloud , Airplay, FaceTime. Why can HP be smart to really see the potential of WebOS as an alternative mobile software operating system for future mobile devices. Haven't they noticed that with the PC business, HP can't stay relevant in the face of competition from other companies......Look at Apple which seems to be investing more on their devices, and focus a bit less on their computers.
    Owner of an HP TouchPad (32GB) and a brand new Palm Pre 3 (16GB) for VZ wireless.
  17. #57  
    Quote Originally Posted by rwhitby View Post
    I've not seen anything which has recanted those plans, nor have I seen any further public announcements related to it.

    -- Rod
    I had asked about this recently in the official forums, and the question was completely ignored (while other things in the same message were responded to). That was pretty frustrating. Then I realized that that's how they treat basically everything that has ever been announced but doesn't currently exist and hasn't been publicly killed.

    It's damn frustrating, and it'd be really awesome if someone could make some dents in that policy. Especially since we're supposed to be moving from this giant walled garden to an open model.
    Author:
    Remove Messaging Beeps patch for webOS 3.0.5, Left/Right bezel gestures in LunaCE,
    Whazaa! Messenger and node-wa, SynerGV 1 and 2 - Google Voice integration, XO - Subsonic Commander media streamer, AB:S Launcher
    (1:39:33 PM) halfhalo: Android multitasking is like sticking your fingers into a blender
    GO OPEN WEBOS!
    People asked me for a donate link for my non-catalog work, so here you are:
  18. #58  
    The Verge thinks msft might be manufacturing its own tablet, possibly b&n aimed at living room. HP said awhile ago they are debuting a back-to -school win tablet. So MSFT takes consumer and HP is left to duke it out w Dell and others for students who want both fun and robust Office capability? Grab your popcorn, this is not over yet for webOS.
  19. #59  
    I have lived the experience of palm's rise and fall over the years.

    I am not going to read that article.

    I am not going to wallow in pity or cradle my pre2 and cry softly for it when it someday dies.

    I will fight.

    I will go down defiantly to the bitter end until my supply of palmOS and webOS devices is entirely exhausted, hoisting a big frigging middle finger to Apple, Google, Microsoft, RIM and Verizon.

    When my last palm/webOS phone has passed fighting the good fight...as I look out over the apocalyptic rubble of dead mobile devices and see the iOS hordes approaching I will hear:

    (King Henry V)

    WESTMORELAND. O that we now had here
    But one ten thousand of android phones in England
    That do no work to-day!

    KING. What's he that wishes so?
    My cousin Westmoreland? No, my fair cousin;
    If we are mark'd to die, we are enow
    To do our country loss; and if to live,
    The fewer men, the greater share of honour.
    God's will! I pray thee, wish not one android more.

    By Jove, I am not covetous for apps,
    Nor care I if flash feed upon my cpu;
    It yearns me not if my phone be dated;
    Such outward things dwell not in my desires.
    But if it be a sin to covet webOS,
    I am the most offending soul alive.

    No, faith, my coz, wish not an android from England.
    God's peace! I would not lose so great an honour
    As one man more methinks would share from me
    For the best phone I have. O, do not wish one more!
    Rather proclaim it, Westmoreland, through my host,
    That he which hath no stomach to flick cards,
    Let him depart; his passport shall be made,
    And crowns for convoy put into his purse;
    We would not die in that man's company
    That fears his fellowship to die with us.

    This day is call'd the feast of webOS.
    He that outlives this day, and comes safe home,
    Will stand a tip-toe when this day is nam'd,
    And rouse him at the name of webOS.
    He that shall live this day, and see old age,
    Will yearly on the vigil feast his neighbours,
    And say 'To-morrow is webOS.'

    Then will he strip his sleeve and show his scars,
    And say 'These wounds I had on webOS's day.'
    Old men forget; yet all shall be forgot,
    But he'll remember, with advantages,
    What feats he did that day…

    We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
    For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
    Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
    This day shall gentle his condition;
    And gentlemen in England now-a-bed
    Shall think themselves accurs'd they were not here,
    And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
    That fought with us upon webOS's day.
    Last edited by sbopple; 06/15/2012 at 08:43 AM.
  20. #60  
    What I think when I read this story about MSFT manufacturing its own tablet and The Verge quote from some HP person about how they couldn't get the parts they wanted without building a factory in China is that the writing was on the wall some time ago that vertical integration was the best way to insure a reliable supply of quality parts. And that is why Google bought Motorola and MSFT might be making its own tablet.
    Hurd saw the writing on the wall and wanted to make webOS his defacto O/S so HP would be weaned away from MSFT dependency if this day occurred.
    Leo saw the writing on the wall and wanted to run away and only make enterprise software.
    Meg seems to be charting closer to Hurd but she will move more towards enterprise hardware (with a shrinking PC market) and hope to enlarge enterprise software and services. In consumer she will preserve webOS as an option for the day when infrastructure makes it possible to have web apps .

    To my mind, apps are going away as a differentiator as it moves towards the web and everyone knows this including Apple although it might be 2-3 years away. So the key forward for Apple and MSFT creating an ecosystem of devices that can talk to each other--ie the phone and tablet to the tv so that consumers will stay in their eco system and not mix and match to the cheapest appliance. I'm not sure how HP can play in this forward game if so. Perhaps some of the 3rd party tv manufacturers would pick up webOS instead of Android.
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