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  1. #21  
    Of course not, he's there to try and convince people to keep on doing it, that is what he is paid for - my point is that it is a very difficult sell to make in the present climate when there is no hardware partner on the horizon and Amazon are gearing up with the Fire.
    Back on topic, they have nothing to tell, so while this continues, it's better to stay silent about it, than saying nothing.

    I think that really there is a last chance for webOS as OS (Enyo has it's own space), and we don't have seen everything in the market.

    A week ago, Samsung was commited to Android and Bada. Today Bada is abandoned (not possible debating, it's the same path that Nokia followed with it's OSs), and Samsung is commited to their new and shiny partnership with Intel, which will become in a web-based OS, like webOS, but three years later.

    If I where Sony, LG or HTC, I would be really worried about all of this. The "one OS for all" it's becoming one webapp for all OSs, and differentation will become more and more important as the market matures. And on this new webapp+differentiation scenario, webOS and Enyo have both technological and customizability (this word exists?) advantadges over any other OSs, not counting maturity.

    If HP knows how to play it's cards (and that "if" is so "if" that hurts), Enyo could become the mobile development standard (there are huge reasons to think so), and webOS could become a relevant player.


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  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by deCorvett View Post
    If HP knows how to play it's cards (and that "if" is so "if" that hurts), Enyo could become the mobile development standard (there are huge reasons to think so), and webOS could become a relevant player.
    YES, and that's one of the things that frustrates me about Kerris. The best way to improve developer relations right now is to give developers a way out: let them develop Enyo elsewhere. It makes it orders of magnitude easier to get them back later when they are still using the same developer framework. Every day, I see another story about another "groundbreaking" HTML5 framework, and I always think, "They really have no idea about Enyo." It is heads and shoulders above anything out there today, but HP just sits on it.
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by deCorvett View Post

    If HP knows how to play it's cards (and that "if" is so "if" that hurts), Enyo could become the mobile development standard (there are huge reasons to think so), and webOS could become a relevant player.


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    HP already played their cards in worst imaginable way, and webOS is now officially old drunken hooker which no one would marry anymore.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by chalx View Post
    HP already played their cards in worst imaginable way, and webOS is now officially old drunken hooker which no one would marry anymore.
    No relevant info added to the debate, just your opinion and, frankly, it doesn't count more than mine.

    Try at least to make a constructive post.

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  5. cgk
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    #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by rsanchez1 View Post
    YES, and that's one of the things that frustrates me about Kerris. The best way to improve developer relations right now is to give developers a way out: let them develop Enyo elsewhere. It makes it orders of magnitude easier to get them back later when they are still using the same developer framework. Every day, I see another story about another "groundbreaking" HTML5 framework, and I always think, "They really have no idea about Enyo." It is heads and shoulders above anything out there today, but HP just sits on it.

    But like all things, technical standards are only a small part of making a platform successful - the real issue here (as we keep coming back to) is the lack of drive and direction from HP. If they want Enyo to be a success, then HP needs to show in a public way that they stand behind it and they stand behind it in a big way.
  6. #26  
    But like all things, technical standards are only a small part of making a platform successful - the real issue here (as we keep coming back to) is the lack of drive and direction from HP. If they want Enyo to be a success, then HP needs to show in a public way that they stand behind it and they stand behind it in a big way.
    That's the point, and that's the issue. I'm not confident at all in their commitment and their ability to develol a webOS master plan at this point.

    I know webOS people has big plans on on both Enyo and webOS (and they're really innovative and capable) but they're not the people who make decissions, and they've shown their abilities on making them, and how badly they've managed their credibility.

    That's the reason because I think the only solution for webOS is to sell the Bussiness Unit. But then there is another issue: how much money they pretend to get from the company they've devaluated totally?


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  7. gbp
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    #27  
    Its not Enyo or mojo, its about creating
    "Lag free , quality devices that are good looking"
    again
    "Lag free , quality devices that are good looking"

    They need critical mass i.e sizable customers for staying in the game. They should have release half cooked phones in other form factors before working on Enyo.

    Where HP lost is not releasing phones with other form factors after acquisition. Somebody up the chain should have put Ruby to fire. They did not.

    My point is, average user is the God here. He will decide if the platform is a success or failure. For the average user, no double taps, no lags, no crashes.. "The thing should work" and he cares nothing about Enyo.
  8. gbp
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    #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by rsanchez1 View Post
    YES, and that's one of the things that frustrates me about Kerris. The best way to improve developer relations right now is to give developers a way out: let them develop Enyo elsewhere. It makes it orders of magnitude easier to get them back later when they are still using the same developer framework. Every day, I see another story about another "groundbreaking" HTML5 framework, and I always think, "They really have no idea about Enyo." It is heads and shoulders above anything out there today, but HP just sits on it.
    Kerris cannot cheer anyone in current situation.

    There is "upper management" . Most of the times the "upper guys" will tell Kerris to shut up for sometime.

    Take it with a pinch of salt, I heard that they are planning to reintroduce the "Touchpad Go" at cheaper price., plus thinking about improved Touchpad.
    Last edited by gbp; 10/01/2011 at 10:55 PM.
  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by gbp View Post
    Kerris cannot cheer anyone at current situation.

    There is "upper management" . Most of the times the "upper guys" will tell Kerris to shut up for sometime.

    Take it with a pinch of salt, I heard that they are planning to reintroduce the "Touchpad Go" at cheaper price.
    Haha, where did you hear that? I want to believe that SO badly! :P
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by deCorvett View Post
    No relevant info added to the debate, just your opinion and, frankly, it doesn't count more than mine.

    Try at least to make a constructive post.

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
    You guys are hilarious.
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by volcom45 View Post
    Haha, where did you hear that? I want to believe that SO badly! :P
    I highly doubt it, but I wouldn't get surprised at this point. It was ready for prime time, so all the development efforts are spent.

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  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by gbp View Post
    Its not Enyo or mojo, its about creating
    "Lag free , quality devices that are good looking"
    again
    "Lag free , quality devices that are good looking"

    They need critical mass i.e sizable customers for staying in the game. They should have release half cooked phones in other form factors before working on Enyo.

    Where HP lost is not releasing phones with other form factors after acquisition. Somebody up the chain should have put Ruby to fire. They did not.

    My point is, average user is the God here. He will decide if the platform is a success or failure. For the average user, no double taps, no lags, no crashes.. "The thing should work" and he cares nothing about Enyo.
    Another half-cooked device? No, thanks. But I'm with you: webOS needed a slab phone. More than a tablet. But Enyo is a consequence of the tablet, and not the opposite. If HP forces Palm to put webOS on the tablet as the highest priority, and if you don't give them more resources, then this is what you get.

    Anyways, I think it's irrelevant whatever HP had launched. After reading Engadget's review for the Pre3, I'm sure media would've trashed it anyways.

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  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by chalx View Post
    You guys are hilarious.
    Well, at least we know and assume our faults.

    I continue not seeing relevant points on your posts.

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  14. #34  
    The thing that bugs me the most is the impression I get that "upper management" at HP either 1) has no real understanding of webOS or 2) naively believed that it would only take a song and a dance to get webOS to be a top contender, and completely ignores the fact that both Apple and Google waaaay outspend them on R&D to make iOS and Android what it is.

    What we do know for sure, though, is that upper management at HP is very short-sighted. Their public communication is all about the next quarters and the empty "providing value" for our shareholder. Why? It's because HP has become a company made up of a bunch of companies that sometimes don't have much in common with one another. In other words, HP has become a directionless company whose only direction is to make sure the next quarter will be okay.

    The end result is exactly what we're witnessing: long-range, strategic vision and thinking is discouraged (see Rahul Sood's webpost).
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by gbp View Post
    Somebody up the chain should have put Ruby to fire. They did not.
    Oh they did, that's why he is rotting in the bowels of HP. Unfortunately it came too little, too late. It should've come as soon as he said, "I have this great concept on this tiny little phone" and again when he said, "Don't worry, it's ready to ship."
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by rsanchez1 View Post
    Oh they did, that's why he is rotting in the bowels of HP. Unfortunately it came too little, too late. It should've come as soon as he said, "I have this great concept on this tiny little phone" and again when he said, "Don't worry, it's ready to ship."
    Could you imagine if Apple announces the iPhone nano on their next event? I don't think it's a bad concept, it's just not the cool company.

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  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by un_designer View Post
    The thing that bugs me the most is the impression I get that "upper management" at HP either 1) has no real understanding of webOS or 2) naively believed that it would only take a song and a dance to get webOS to be a top contender, and completely ignores the fact that both Apple and Google waaaay outspend them on R&D to make iOS and Android what it is.

    What we do know for sure, though, is that upper management at HP is very short-sighted. Their public communication is all about the next quarters and the empty "providing value" for our shareholder. Why? It's because HP has become a company made up of a bunch of companies that sometimes don't have much in common with one another. In other words, HP has become a directionless company whose only direction is to make sure the next quarter will be okay.

    The end result is exactly what we're witnessing: long-range, strategic vision and thinking is discouraged (see Rahul Sood's webpost).
    HP just communicated badly whole direction shift. Their plans are not short sighted at all. If you recall, they made calculation in which webOS would generate loss for years, and HP simply can't afford that kind of gamble.
  18. #38  
    HP just communicated badly whole direction shift. Their plans are not short sighted at all. If you recall, they made calculation in which webOS would generate loss for years, and HP simply can't afford that kind of gamble.
    I can't buy that argument, not after seeing how much they're going to pay for Autonomy. WebOS generated a loss of 380? (I don't remember, sorry) millions on the only quarter with a remarcable device on the streets (the Touchpad). How many days the tablet sales count for that quarter? That's the reason for that hurry on releasing the Touchpad: they needed an excuse to kill the devices.

    This was going to happen, anyways, because the board wanted this to happen. The question that comes to my mind is if Hurd wasn't fired because of this exact thing, I can't believe the expenses reports reasoning after this whole debacle and cash burning.
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  19. #39  
    I tend to agree with you as well. And having heard from HP employees first hand how much of a disarray and how much of a companies within companies that HP is, it sorta makes sense. There are many different groups under the HP umbrella all doing different things and all with different visions of what kind of a company HP is/ought to be. It just seems like politics is what happened, and the group that has control is the group that wants to make HP into an IBM.

    The funny thing though, is that they're spending the money that the other groups made to buy an overpriced company, hoping to be successful. If that's not stupidity...
  20. gbp
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    #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by volcom45 View Post
    Haha, where did you hear that? I want to believe that SO badly! :P
    its the chatter inside HP , specifically during the company firesale.
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