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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by ronnienyc View Post
    Ok, but you are in the minority. Their job is to make money and stay in business, not to appease the handful of people who like the failed Pre. (I know it seems like more when you are on these forums, but going by the sales figures, it's a handful.) The best selling Sprint smartphone is a slab. The best selling phones on every carrier are slabs. Once HP have their webOS slab sorted out they can worry about keeping the old guard appeased with the Pre 4, Pre 5, Small Pre, Large Pre, zzzzzzz.

    (for the record, I owned about 5 Pres...)
    Torch is selling reasonably well here in Canada, I see them everywhere.

    And re-read my comment, I said if they go slab ONLY. I don't care if they build a slab as a flagship, but keep the vertical slider around as mid-range. I also don't need raw horsepower in my phone either.

    If they don't release the Pre3 I think I'll have to keep this Veer for a long time.
    Palm IIIc -> Sony CLIÉ T650C -> Sony TJ-37 -> Palm TX -> Palm Centro -> Palm Pre Bell -> Palm Pre Plus Bell/Verizon Hybrid -> HP Veer -> HP Pre 3 NA -> BlackBerry Classic -> BlackBerry Priv

    It's a Late Goodbye, such a Late Goodbye.

    Need OEM Palm Pre parts? See here
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by ronnienyc View Post
    Ok, but you are in the minority. Their job is to make money and stay in business, not to appease the handful of people who like the failed Pre. (I know it seems like more when you are on these forums, but going by the sales figures, it's a handful.) The best selling Sprint smartphone is a slab. The best selling phones on every carrier are slabs. Once HP have their webOS slab sorted out they can worry about keeping the old guard appeased with the Pre 4, Pre 5, Small Pre, Large Pre, zzzzzzz.

    (for the record, I owned about 5 Pres...)
    Why do you assume everyone out there is drooling for a slab?
    I look at it as manufacturers shoving products down the consumers' throats via lack of choices. Where are the small cars that we had in the 80s and 90s? They just keep getting bigger and that's what ppl buy and that's what the car makers keep making. Computer makers have all but killed 16:10 res screens in favor of a 16:9 "HD" aspect ratio screen. And that's what ppl buy b/c that's all they CAN buy. But many lament those 16:10 screens. If you put out nothing but slab phones and credit those phone b/c many are truly great slabs but then you don't release an incredible physical keyboard phone, ppl will continue to buy slabs b/c that's really all that's realistically available... but that doesn't mean everyone wants it. It just means they buy it b/c of lack of options.
  3.    #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by laoh View Post
    Why do you assume everyone out there is drooling for a slab?
    I look at it as manufacturers shoving products down the consumers' throats via lack of choices...It just means they buy it b/c of lack of options.
    I am not assuming anything. I am just looking at the sales numbers.
    Anyway, look at the Sprint site:
    http://shop.sprint.com/mysprint/shop...=ATG:HE:Phones

    There are all shapes and sizes of phones on there. It looks like they have around 42 phones on there. Most of them are not slabs. So you can't argue that there is no choice, can you?

    But which phones sell the most? BlackBerrys and slabs. Why? Because people like them more than sliders. (Though Samsung has sold a boat load of those Epics.)

    But getting back to the Pre: it has not sold well, so why keep it as your flagship?? And, from a business standpoint, why keep it at all? We already know that it does not have enough fans to make a profit, right? So why keep it? I imagine this is why Ruby lost his job. Keep tooling with a failed product instead of cutting their losses, moving on and giving people what they want, instead of giving them something which they have already made clear they do not want.
    Last edited by ronnienyc; 07/11/2011 at 11:27 PM.
  4. #24  
    Third time's the charm?
  5. #25  
    I like how they spin it as the next great thing for webOS, though it sounds more like Ruby **** something up. What is he now again? Head of Product Innovation? Doesn't that sound like that senior employee that couldn't just be fired so he gets moved to an office in the middle of nowhere, where he can't mess with things?
    Don't get me wrong, I like Ruby. But that doesn't sound good. Sounds like things are on fire there.
  6. #26  
    My take is that the move is designed to get WebOS ported to Printers, PC, and Toasters. This process needs plenty of vision.

    He needs to answer the following questions.
    1) How will WebOS work seamlessly within Windows? I can run it in the emulater right now, and let me tell you it's not great.
    2) Why do I need WebOS on a printer?
    3) How will WebOS work with the cheap gutless CPU likely to be put in printers?
    kkhanmd likes this.
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by ronnienyc View Post
    I am not assuming anything. I am just looking at the sales numbers.
    Anyway, look at the Sprint site:
    http://shop.sprint.com/mysprint/shop...=ATG:HE:Phones

    There are all shapes and sizes of phones on there. It looks like they have around 42 phones on there. Most of them are not slabs. So you can't argue that there is no choice, can you?

    But which phones sell the most? BlackBerrys and slabs. Why? Because people like them more than sliders. (Though Samsung has sold a boat load of those Epics.)

    But getting back to the Pre: it has not sold well, so why keep it as your flagship?? And, from a business standpoint, why keep it at all? We already know that it does not have enough fans to make a profit, right? So why keep it? I imagine this is why Ruby lost his job. Keep tooling with a failed product instead of cutting their losses, moving on and giving people what they want, instead of giving them something which they have already made clear they do not want.
    That's because Sprint doesn't have any sliders other than the Pre, and let alone a decent one. The Pre is like 2 years old already.

    You completely ignored me when I said the Torch sells well and Sprint isn't HSPA so they don't have it. You do know there is a world outside of Sprint and US right?

    I do agree with one thing though, the Pre is not flagship. I never considered it to be and which is why I bought it.
    Palm IIIc -> Sony CLIÉ T650C -> Sony TJ-37 -> Palm TX -> Palm Centro -> Palm Pre Bell -> Palm Pre Plus Bell/Verizon Hybrid -> HP Veer -> HP Pre 3 NA -> BlackBerry Classic -> BlackBerry Priv

    It's a Late Goodbye, such a Late Goodbye.

    Need OEM Palm Pre parts? See here
  8. #28  
    I like the form factor and size of my Pre Plus. It fits well in my shirt pocket (next to my heart). It is easy to read. It is easy to use one handed. I love it and want to keep it, but alas it just isn’t powerful enough to be up-gradable to the newer versions of webOS. So let’s see a Pre 2 Plus with the specs of the Pre 3 but the size of the Pre 2.

    I think most of the posters here are correct that the Pre form factor is not for everyone, so HP needs to have webOS on as many different form factors and sizes as they can to appeal to all the market. Bring on multi-sized sliders, slabs, bars, bricks, slates, flips and swivels but get them with similar operating specs so webOS will run well on all of them and they all can get the same OTA updates.

    As for Ruby moving on… I wish him well but also think he was the jockey in a one horse race for too long and it is time for someone else to take the reigns.
    Palm m130 > Verizon Trēo 650 > Verizon Trēo 755p > Verizon Palm Prē Plus > TouchPad > Verizon Palm Prē 2
    ~ The Future's Just Not What it Used To Be ~
  9.    #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToniCipriani View Post
    That's because Sprint doesn't have any sliders other than the Pre, and let alone a decent one. The Pre is like 2 years old already.

    You completely ignored me when I said the Torch sells well and Sprint isn't HSPA so they don't have it. You do know there is a world outside of Sprint and US right?
    1. Sprint has a number of sliders, but most of them are horizontal.

    2. I do no think the BB Torch is relevant to this discussion. But since you brought it up, I think the Torch has sold because it is the only viable BB touch screen phone, as opposed to selling a lot because everyone wanted a slider. But hey, we are only guessing here, right?

    3. I am not ignoring the rest of the world: is there a market where the Pre reached its sales goals which I am not aware of? I think it failed everywhere they tried to launch it, no?

    4. It seems to me that the fact that some other manufacturer sells a bunch of sliders has no bearing on this topic at all. Palm/HP already knows that there are not enough buyers for the Pre, and they respond by producing more Pres. Where is the logic there?
    Last edited by ronnienyc; 07/12/2011 at 11:50 AM.
  10. #30  
    Hi all

    Here's a little more on that subject...the title says it all. See Link.

    Take care,

    Jay

    HP Demotes Jon Rubenstein Upward, Out of webOS Group
    By Humberto Saabedra on July 11, 2011

    HP Demotes Jon Rubenstein Upward, Out of webOS Group | PhoneNews.com

    HP has announced in a purely shareholder focused press release that it has moved former Palm CEO and now former Senior Vice President and General Manager of the Palm Global Business Group Jon Rubenstein into a new role with a new title within HP, more specifically a “product innovation role within the Personal Systems Group”.

    In his place, Stephen DeWitt, former Senior Vice President of the Personal Systems Group in the Americas will now assume a leadership role in the newly renamed webOS Global Business Group and will oversee all aspects of webOS from development to marketing.
    Please Support Research into Fibromyalgia, Chronic Pain and Spinal Injuries. If You Suffer from These, Consider Joining or Better Yet Forming a Support Group. No One Should Suffer from the Burden of Chronic Pain, Jay M. S. Founder, Leesburg Fibromyalgia/Resources Group
  11. dv220s's Avatar
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    #31  
    Moving Jon was a good thing. Watching those Engadget interview things were painful. All he did was effectively lower hype for the Pre3 because he didn't bring anything interesting to the table and brought more and more of the same things we've heard from a long time ago. Also, I believe he said that they would announce products closer to launch, they obviously didn't follow through with that. February was announcement, we still haven't seen the Pre3 and it's going to fall behind if they don't get it out. Samsung is doing so well with the SGS 2 in other countries and they haven't even gotten here yet. They are also building a SGS 2 variant for Windows Phone but with a 1.4/1.5 GHz Snapdragon. I call it the Focus2 and it looks super thin. HP still has competition but will lose it if they don't stop sleeping.
  12. #32  
    Hi all,

    The handwriting was on the wall the minute the 1st review for the TouchPad came out....as of a few days ago, I thought they should have released the TouchPad when they did...but now with hide-sight and Jon's "lateral demotion"...I think they would have been better off delaying if until they got they update out that is supposed to be "around the corner"..

    This was also easy to predict when HP said that these were the last 3 products designed by the Palm design group and future designs were going be designed by the HP design group...

    Unless I'm mistaken isn't the Pre3 supposed to be able to be upgraded to to webOS 3.xx and was going to ship with webOS 2.xx? I'm now wondering that they may have delayed the Pre 3, until they can get 3.xx on it.

    What amazes me about all of this, is that Ruby was given a great deal of credit for reworking the Centro's designs as soon as he arrived at Palm...what happened? He over achieved early in his career at Apple and at the beginning of his tenure at Palm?


    I would appreciate any opinions!

    Take care,

    jay
    Please Support Research into Fibromyalgia, Chronic Pain and Spinal Injuries. If You Suffer from These, Consider Joining or Better Yet Forming a Support Group. No One Should Suffer from the Burden of Chronic Pain, Jay M. S. Founder, Leesburg Fibromyalgia/Resources Group
  13. #33  
    I always thought that Rubenstein being the face of the company was a bad idea, and that he's a better engineer.

    That being said, why do people act like there's only one person making decisions and behind all of this stuff? I was reading on Engadget's comments (mistake, I know) how now that Rubenstein was being pushed aside, the brains behind webOS aren't in charge anymore. Last I checked, webOS already existed as a skunkworks project before Rubenstein was even hired, and after that it took a large number of people to turn it into a commercial product, not just one.

    It seems to me that Rubenstein was in charge at Palm, and he did the best with the time and (lack of) resources he had. Moving him to an engineering / ideas role suits his talents better, and I'm not quite sure why it's such a big deal.
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