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  1. #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by DDT1345 View Post
    Good points.

    However, I don't see HP doing this either, but I started this thread because Apotheker said he want's people to say "as cool as HP" instead of "as cool as Apple." I don't think that the "as cool as HP" imagine is acheivable without an "HP Store."

    Rebranding, reimaging, and HP Store, etc. very well may not be necessary for HP to make money on WebOS, but that's not what I'm talking about here. I'm specifically talking about the "as cool as HP" notion. Without an HP Store, I never see that happening. A corner of a Best Buy just won't cut it.
    I don't see it either.

    Apple is just high end consumer oriented. But i'm not sure where HP is focused or where they want to be focused. Learning they'll be doing "hipster" commercials is discouraging.

    I paid more for my HP laserjet because its what i consider a prosumer product.

    Same with Canon cameras over the years. Or even Canon printers (got a pro9000 printer).

    The trick with tablets and phones of course is putting the "pro" in prosumer. I think we already know they need to have good looks and specs. But what makes these things professional? That's going to be what locks in a premium price.

    Productivity. I see many rationalizing their tablet purchases for these reasons that often seems more like wishful thinking. HP needs to truly make these productive as well as focusing on looks, ease of use, and just being fun to use.

    Compatibility with office webapps might be a start. I'm not sure what kind of pull they have with MS, but an office suite would be killer. Find out what law firms use, accounting firms use, doctors. For example, in accounting, i want scanning apps, office, tax planning app, amortization, tenkey, etc.

    It needs a file manager. End of story.

    If they can do this and carry this message across, they will find their niche.
  2. #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    Tell me about it, I purchased a HP laptop last week and it was absolutely loaded with junk-ware - It was simply easier to wipe it and do a clean install than deal with removing it all.
    I will be utterly surprised if the phones don't follow suit.
  3. #43  
    I think it will be a GOOD idea for HP to open up stores like Apple does, but only once they get a good amount of Webos products out. Then they could couple the Webos phones, tablets, and notbooks, with their line of other laptops and printers. To me this would push them right into direct competiton with apple, and really make them more then just a formable foe. Though as stated I would wait maybe 6 months to a year to even consider doing so, pending on how well their first wave of webos products do.
  4. #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by wellwellwell11 View Post
    I think it will be a GOOD idea for HP to open up stores like Apple does, but only once they get a good amount of Webos products out. Then they could couple the Webos phones, tablets, and notbooks, with their line of other laptops and printers. To me this would push them right into direct competiton with apple, and really make them more then just a formable foe. Though as stated I would wait maybe 6 months to a year to even consider doing so, pending on how well their first wave of webos products do.
    It's more than that too. They could offer support. Sell those warranty plans better. Not let the geek team at Best Buy do all your support or carry your message.

    But stores make you real to the masses. It's all a marketing expense IMO. That Apple has crowds of people in their stores is just icing on the cake. I find malls boring myself...doesn't matter what kind of gadget store it is, just as long as i can waste time while the wife is going to the boring stores.
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       #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by wellwellwell11 View Post
    I think it will be a GOOD idea for HP to open up stores like Apple does, but only once they get a good amount of Webos products out. Then they could couple the Webos phones, tablets, and notbooks, with their line of other laptops and printers. To me this would push them right into direct competiton with apple, and really make them more then just a formable foe. Though as stated I would wait maybe 6 months to a year to even consider doing so, pending on how well their first wave of webos products do.
    Yes, I could see this happening, everything HP makes, even Windows-based laptops could be sold at the store. They could focus on the Envy (high-end) line of laptops. They could provide a tie-in from Windows to WebOS by providing some software, maybe like iTunes (but not a resource hog!) to connect your WebOS devices into the Windows environment, sync music, movies, etc.

    But the key to a store is to get people to learn about the products and how they work together. Get people like P|C forum members to be the "geniuses" that work in the store. People who love the products and know how to use them and show them off.

    I have a full-time job already and I'd even consider working at an "HP Garage" store part-time just for fun (and employee discounts). (I really like the "HP Garage" name, credit to @realistdreamer for coming up with it) I just think it could be a lot of fun, as I'd imagine Apple enthusiasts are prob the people working at the Apple Store.

    Kevin
    DDT1345
  6. cgk
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    #46  
    "over here we have some grey box PCs, over there are some grey box PCs. This is a HP G2452363 it differs from the HP 2345325 by having an additional USB port, however it is not the same as the HP 34234546 which has a two additional ports or the HP G35435436 which has none".

    I can see it now.
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       #47  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    "over here we have some grey box PCs, over there are some grey box PCs. This is a HP G2452363 it differs from the HP 2345325 by having an additional USB port, however it is not the same as the HP 34234546 which has a two additional ports or the HP G35435436 which has none".

    I can see it now.
    I think you may be missing the point. A store wouldn't be comparing computer to computer, it would be showing how the different devices work together.

    But, yes, I agree that HP's line of laptops and computers are a bit cheap and lame, if that is what you are getting at.
  8. cgk
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    #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by DDT1345 View Post
    I think you may be missing the point. A store wouldn't be comparing computer to computer, it would be showing how the different devices work together.

    But, yes, I agree that HP's line of laptops and computers are a bit cheap and lame, if that is what you are getting at.
    Nothing wrong with that, I just purchased a HP laptop for that very reason but to create a retail experience?
  9. #49  
    Quote Originally Posted by DDT1345 View Post
    I think you may be missing the point. A store wouldn't be comparing computer to computer, it would be showing how the different devices work together.

    But, yes, I agree that HP's line of laptops and computers are a bit cheap and lame, if that is what you are getting at.
    but thats why HP also helps the company be profitable they offer all lines of affordable, to high end. Apple really is just high end products, and I dont see nothing wrong with offering budget type products. I for one have a high end Pavillion and compared to my old macbook pro the quality, specs and speed are more then comparable.
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       #50  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    Nothing wrong with that, I just purchased a HP laptop for that very reason but to create a retail experience?
    I know, I know, it's a stretch, but we're just dreaming what's possible. That's all. Lots of things would have to change, but from Apotheker's comments, this is the road they want to take. I'm not holding my breath though, just speculating what it could be like. I understand it would take a lot of change, a lot of time, and a lot of money.
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       #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by wellwellwell11 View Post
    but thats why HP also helps the company be profitable they offer all lines of affordable, to high end. Apple really is just high end products, and I dont see nothing wrong with offering budget type products. I for one have a high end Pavillion and compared to my old macbook pro the quality, specs and speed are more then comparable.

    I wasn't knocking HP's entire line, just responding to CGK's comment.

    I think an HP Store is possible, just not likely. They could focus only on the high-end line as I mentioned before. After explaining the benefits, the integration etc, if people don't want to spend the extra money, then they could down-sell them to a more affordable line of laptops one that can be ordered in-store, but shipped to the person's home from a distributor. But at this point the people would have been exposed to the WebOS/HP ecosystem and they'll have been educated to the Apple alternative. Too many people think only Apple products do certain things (my own family members included).
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    #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by andyhurley View Post
    I've often wondered what Apple stores are for. The ones I have seen have generally been fairly empty with just a handful of spotty teenagers playing with the displays. I didn't realise people actually bought things there and assumed they were a loss leader for Apple.

    Clearly I was wrong.
    I can't find any numbers on profit, but Apple Store revenue for Q1 2011 was $3.85 billion (with $26.74 billion of revenue and $6 billion of profit for the whole company).

    Quote Originally Posted by astraith View Post
    In fact, they are the only computer store that was able to do this. Gateway stopped doing it. Why? Because they could no longer successfully make money compared to Dell.
    I think Gateway Country could have helped Gateway beat Dell. The stores failed because they didn't have any inventory (with the exception of some holiday trials), Gateway skimped out on real estate, opened way too many stores too quickly, and undertrained employees.
    "Visits? Well that would indicate visitors."
    "Future events such as these will affect you in the future."
  13. #53  
    Quote Originally Posted by DDT1345 View Post
    I wasn't knocking HP's entire line, just responding to CGK's comment.

    I think an HP Store is possible, just not likely. They could focus only on the high-end line as I mentioned before. After explaining the benefits, the integration etc, if people don't want to spend the extra money, then they could down-sell them to a more affordable line of laptops one that can be ordered in-store, but shipped to the person's home from a distributor. But at this point the people would have been exposed to the WebOS/HP ecosystem and they'll have been educated to the Apple alternative. Too many people think only Apple products do certain things (my own family members included).
    thats def true, I guess I see HP with webos can do what Apple has done only IF their intial products take off. Then people will see what Webos can do, then they will weigh it with the alternative to companys like Apple. To me unlike Google (who uses venders to sell its OS) HP, like Apple and Microsoft own their own OS, so to me it would make sense only if they are profitable, to have stores to show off its product. I see this as a thing to do, have their own seminors (like feb 9th) like Apple, then follow their lead since to me they are doing whats right in marketing and selling their products a proven system.
  14. #54  
    They already exist.

    I recently spent some time in South Africa and found a "HP Experience Store" in Johannesburg (Sandton City mall, just if anybody is curious). It looked pretty slick, with black and generally dark shades prevailing in the decor.

    When I was there between Christmas and New Year, the HP experience consisted mainly of HP Envy laptops and HP TouchSmart desktops, with HP ePrint printers and nifty third-party accessories thrown in for good measure. They did have one of those android tablet printers, but it was hidden at the back.

    I talked to a clerk about the coming deluge of webOS stuff, and while he couldn't tell me any specifics (surprise, surprise), he did say that they were getting ready for a lot of new stuff - including webOS phones, which he emphasized because you can't currently get any in South Africa. He did add that big news were around the corner although the actual products would not arrive for another few months - hinting as I now know at the announcement of the February 9 announcement and hardware releases following Feb9.

    So yes: HP Stores already exist. At least one does.

    As for the future - call me a starry-eyed fan boy, but I honestly believe that every HP device that has a screen, or attaches to one, will ship with some flavor of webOS in a year's time, creating that unique HP identity some of you find lacking (and not without reason). At this point, I'm assuming that this is going to be central for Apotheker's "secret vision" keynote scheduled for March: that HP's consumer-facing side will not only "double down" on webOS, but that they will go all-in.

    Buy a HP pavilion PC, and it'll ship with a touchscreen and boot into webOS by default. If you find yourself needing that full office suite or photoshop, there'll be a Windows icon in the quicklaunch bar. Tap it, and you're in Windows. 95% of people will probably not need to tap that Windows icon in 95% of cases. And that's how HP becomes cool.

    And that's when it might make sense for them to open up more shops. But then again: HP does command a pretty substantial amount of shelfspace in electronics shops right now, so it might be more economical for them to just let the shops redecorate and open "HP corners".
  15. #55  
    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    They already exist.

    I recently spent some time in South Africa and found a "HP Experience Store" in Johannesburg (Sandton City mall, just if anybody is curious). It looked pretty slick, with black and generally dark shades prevailing in the decor.

    When I was there between Christmas and New Year, the HP experience consisted mainly of HP Envy laptops and HP TouchSmart desktops, with HP ePrint printers and nifty third-party accessories thrown in for good measure. They did have one of those android tablet printers, but it was hidden at the back.

    I talked to a clerk about the coming deluge of webOS stuff, and while he couldn't tell me any specifics (surprise, surprise), he did say that they were getting ready for a lot of new stuff - including webOS phones, which he emphasized because you can't currently get any in South Africa. He did add that big news were around the corner although the actual products would not arrive for another few months - hinting as I now know at the announcement of the February 9 announcement and hardware releases following Feb9.

    So yes: HP Stores already exist. At least one does.

    As for the future - call me a starry-eyed fan boy, but I honestly believe that every HP device that has a screen, or attaches to one, will ship with some flavor of webOS in a year's time, creating that unique HP identity some of you find lacking (and not without reason). At this point, I'm assuming that this is going to be central for Apotheker's "secret vision" keynote scheduled for March: that HP's consumer-facing side will not only "double down" on webOS, but that they will go all-in.

    Buy a HP pavilion PC, and it'll ship with a touchscreen and boot into webOS by default. If you find yourself needing that full office suite or photoshop, there'll be a Windows icon in the quicklaunch bar. Tap it, and you're in Windows. 95% of people will probably not need to tap that Windows icon in 95% of cases. And that's how HP becomes cool.

    And that's when it might make sense for them to open up more shops. But then again: HP does command a pretty substantial amount of shelfspace in electronics shops right now, so it might be more economical for them to just let the shops redecorate and open "HP corners".
    well there you go question answered, as I think this as well is where they are headed. HP has their own OS now, and can compete against the likes of Apple directly.
  16. #56  
    If HP is serious about pushing the product at an accelerated rate then they need local stores. Cannot rely on electronic stores to do this for it will be a battle which company is giving them the better spiffs issue. Having stores like that will increase the pricetag to their products though...
    Try diplomacy first. You can always conquer them later...

    www.webos-internals.org, read it, use it, love it, and donate to it.....
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       #57  
    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    They already exist.
    Cool, thanks for letting us know.

    A quick Google search reveals the press release from HP dated 24 April 2008: LINK

    An image search brings up some images and the associated articles. Very interesting.

    Well, I guess this is HP's chance to bring their "HP Experience" store to new markets and introduce some unique devices (WebOS) to make it worthwhile to actually go to one. Seems like up until now, no one really knows or cares about them, so time to step it up!
  18. #58  
    At the very least I think HP needs to work on the presence they have in existing retail outlets. Go to Best Buy and the Apple products are all sitting on a dedicated hardwood table not unlike they would be at the Apple Store. The HP products are there with everything else. Go to Walmart or Target and the iPod and iPads are in a dedicated display case. At least with the webOS products, HP needs to make sure these products are given dedicated space so that they too are seen as separate and special. Throw them on the shelf with all of the other non-iOS stuff and it'll just get lost int he clutter of Android hardware.
  19. #59  
    Quote Originally Posted by Spinfusor View Post
    I can't find any numbers on profit, but Apple Store revenue for Q1 2011 was $3.85 billion (with $26.74 billion of revenue and $6 billion of profit for the whole company).

    I think Gateway Country could have helped Gateway beat Dell. The stores failed because they didn't have any inventory (with the exception of some holiday trials), Gateway skimped out on real estate, opened way too many stores too quickly, and undertrained employees.
    Which brings it back to poor choices made by the management, wouldn't?
  20. #60  
    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    As for the future - call me a starry-eyed fan boy, but I honestly believe that every HP device that has a screen, or attaches to one, will ship with some flavor of webOS in a year's time, creating that unique HP identity some of you find lacking (and not without reason). At this point, I'm assuming that this is going to be central for Apotheker's "secret vision" keynote scheduled for March: that HP's consumer-facing side will not only "double down" on webOS, but that they will go all-in.

    Buy a HP pavilion PC, and it'll ship with a touchscreen and boot into webOS by default. If you find yourself needing that full office suite or photoshop, there'll be a Windows icon in the quicklaunch bar. Tap it, and you're in Windows. 95% of people will probably not need to tap that Windows icon in 95% of cases. And that's how HP becomes cool.
    There's plenty of ways for them to shoot themselves in the foot, but you're essentially advocating they put their lips around an Uzi, pull the trigger, and just start chowing down on bullets.

    HP's margins are already pretty thin, and their bread and butter are laptops and desktops in the $400-800 range. So they're going to stick resistive (capacitive?...who knows) touchscreens on EVERY PC with a WebOS layer on top, and thereby add a price premium that will kill them (Keep in mind the $800 HP Slate has the internals of a $300 netbook).

    Now all of these low-to-midrange chipsets will be running Linux and Windows 7 simultaneously, and whenever you switch out of Linux/WebOS, the touchscreen essentially becomes useless providing a schizophrenic experience.

    And this would be the centerpiece of their HP stores?
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