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  1. #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by LCGuy View Post
    Will the new WebOS devices be hardware proficient enough to use the WebOS multitasking to its utmost?

    From the specs of the PalmPad with Qualcom 1.2 ghz preocessor and only 512 RAM, Im not so sure... because, well, it does follow that if you make a point about multitiasking, and center the whole UI around that feature, that people will use it, and then abuse it, so, RAM and CPU specs need to be head and heels above everything else.
    I disagree. The only comparison relevant is whether, for a particular OS, the specs are able to handle the resource demands. Whether the Playbook is a resource-hog and needs a quad-core processor with 2 GB of RAM is irrelevant to whether the PalmPad/Topaz/TouchSlate specs can handle webOS 3.0.
  2. #62  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    Normal people don't give a ****e about multi-tasking true or otherwise. Any campaign based around that will fail.

    Sent from my ZTE-BLADE using Tapatalk
    Maybe you never try to do more than one thing at a time. I've owned a Sprint Pre for the last 18 months and picked up an Epic (android) to "try" for 30 days and if you've experienced WebOS multi-tasking than using the Android OS is VERY frustrating.

    Maybe ppl don't THINK they "give a *****e about multi-tasking" (not sure what ****e is...) but if they ever use a WebOS device for an hour or so then they definitely will miss it....like I do!! I'll be returning my Epic and getting the new HPalm WebOS device as soon as they come out!!! Can't wait.
  3. #63  
    Quote Originally Posted by tasogare View Post
    I disagree. The only comparison relevant is whether, for a particular OS, the specs are able to handle the resource demands. Whether the Playbook is a resource-hog and needs a quad-core processor with 2 GB of RAM is irrelevant to whether the PalmPad/Topaz/TouchSlate specs can handle webOS 3.0.
    I agree, and that is exactly what I said above, so, Im not sure why you are disagreeing.

    "The more I learn, the more I realize just how little I really do know!" -Albert Einstein

  4. #64  
    @Mikah912, I think we are in agreement here, although I did get off topic and genralized...lol....didnt meant my last post to be directed at you, but more towards the sentiment of the board.
  5. #65  
    Quote Originally Posted by LCGuy View Post
    You know what??

    Mr. Apotheker responded to the "cool" question with what HE thought was "cool" about WebOS: the way it is so easy to multitask, and, in his opinion, this is the way to really multitask..

    WebOS encourages multitasking because of its use of cards... versus the other OS's which focus on a desktop and a launch of any single function...

    In other words, iOS and Android show you everything you can do initially, so you can pick just one to work on, while WebOS shows you nothing initially, an allows you to start up and have instant access to all the applications on your screen at one time - it is an OS with a user interface that is compoeltely design around its ability to multitask, versus all others!

    With enough CPU power and RAM, you can leave 10 or 15 apps that you use constantly open and just swipe back and forth on WebOS between any of them while the others are running in the background...

    He says that is cool, and I agree, whole heartedly; I believe many people who already use WebOS do, as well, and many more will, once they are exposed to it, with good marketting and publicity.

    The ONLY caviat was, is and always will be this:

    Will the new WebOS devices be hardware proficient enough to use the WebOS multitasking to its utmost?

    From the specs of the PalmPad with Qualcom 1.2 ghz preocessor and only 512 RAM, Im not so sure... because, well, it does follow that if you make a point about multitiasking, and center the whole UI around that feature, that people will use it, and then abuse it, so, RAM and CPU specs need to be head and heels above everything else.

    good points all around on your post

    however, with respect to hardware being proficient enough, it all depends on the user and what types of apps they're leaving in the background. I never actually keep any app open. it's just habit to swipe away and be done. That being said, i'm sure anyone who's familiar with PC's know that if you leave heavy intensive applications opened, you will run down your resources (lets say you leave 5 games open, but really, how many people will do that)?
  6. #66  
    Quote Originally Posted by dandbj13 View Post
    Here is the lead as far as I am concerned:



    This is as close to an official statement I have seen that HP wants to be Apple. They just can't get past the Apple fetish. Go back and read every article about the upcoming pad. Apple and iPad are used to describe it more than any other words. This was highlighted on the latest Palmcast.

    There are few things more uncool than a bunch of old people who don't get it, consciously trying to be cool.
    I think HP wants their competition to envy them, and not their competition -- like Apple. They don't want Dell wanting to be Apple. Or Toshiba wishing they could be Apple. They would rather their competition wishing they could be HP. They of course also want people to look at their product and say wow. Is that a bad thing?

    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    This ("multi-tasking") wasn't a winning strategy when Palm made a big deal out of it. And it's not going to be one now.

    Think of a commercial trumpeting this running during the same half hour cable drama as an iPad commercial. The iPad commercial shows Facetime, games, the NASA app, custom iPad magazines, and the iPad being run as a guitar effects box. HP's commercial shows how you can swipe from window to window instead of hitting the home button to launch apps. Which do you think will be most effective in A) getting someone who doesn't have a tablet to buy one and B) convincing someone looking for a tablet that yours is the one to get?

    Microsoft is running a HUGE ad campaign for Windows Phone 7 in the US trumpeting how it saves you steps, time, and "fumbling through a bunch of apps". yet, the US seems the be the weakest sales territory in a worldwide launch that has been average-to-decent. This just isn't a compelling message for the mainstream audience. They are more concerned with what the phone does, which is why that is all a 30-second Apple iOS consists of. Not how convenient it is to switch between things.



    To a fan of WebOS? Absolutely not. To someone objective, it's absolutely possible given their personal taste.



    I think Android and iOS fans will applaud this, actually.
    I think saying that the multitasking didn't do well last time is kinda a moot point. Can you prove to me why the people who did not buy a Palm Pre didn't care about multitasking? Or could it be they didn't realize what multitasking on a Pre could benefit them? It goes back to marketing, it was horrible and didn't show their customers why they need WebOS to live. Why should people care when you don't tell them why they shoudl care?

    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    Normal people don't give a ****e about multi-tasking true or otherwise. Any campaign based around that will fail.

    Sent from my ZTE-BLADE using Tapatalk
    Then why is Apple changing their OS to add gestures -- so you can multitask and switch your applications quickly and easily? If people don't care about it, why would Apple care about doing that? Don't tell me you believe Apple is just coping Palm... do you?

    Of course you don't, and of course normal people want to multitask. It is HP/Apple's job to tell you why you should care. Any one who has worked in sales would tell you this is true.
  7. #67  
    Quote Originally Posted by Ehsan View Post
    ...snipits not just specific apps (like on iphone its only radio/music apps).
    If you make a statement, make it factual...

    Multitasking iOS 4 delivers seven new multitasking services that allow your apps to perform tasks in the background while preserving battery life and performance. These multitasking services include:

    • Background audio - Allows your app to play audio continuously. So customers can listen to your app while they surf the web, play games, and more.
    • Voice over IP - Your VoIP apps can now be even better. Users can now receive VoIP calls and have conversations while using another app. Your users can even receive calls when their phones are locked in their pocket.
    • Background location - Navigation apps can now continue to guide users who are listening to their iPods, or using other apps. iOS 4 also provides a new and battery-efficient way to monitor location when users move between cell towers. This is a great way for your social networking apps to keep track of users and their friends' locations.
    • Push notifications - Receive alerts from your remote servers even when your app isn't running.
    • Local notifications - Your app can now alert users of scheduled events and alarms in the background, no servers required.
    • Task finishing - If your app is in mid-task when your customer leaves it, the app can now keep running to finish the task.
    • Fast app switching - All developers should take advantage of fast app switching, which allows users to leave your app and come right back to where they were when they left - no more having to reload the app.


    This is the scope of the shall we say "limited" multitasking. This is not a knock of webos.


    Quote Originally Posted by astraith View Post
    ...snip
    Then why is Apple changing their OS to add gestures -- so you can multitask and switch your applications quickly and easily? If people don't care about it, why would Apple care about doing that? Don't tell me you believe Apple is just coping Palm... do you?
    ...Maybe because of the wildly popular jailbroken app Activator?
  8. #68  
    Quote Originally Posted by astraith View Post
    Then why is Apple changing their OS to add gestures -- so you can multitask and switch your applications quickly and easily? If people don't care about it, why would Apple care about doing that? Don't tell me you believe Apple is just coping Palm... do you?
    I think you have missed the bigger picture. Apple is not doing any of that to "become" successful. They are adding (optional) gestures four generations later because they already "are" successful. They didn't build their empire on advanced gestures for basic functionality. From my limited observation, most iPhone users don't even use the task switching. They still prefer the original navigation metaphor.

    HP trying to build an empire on the basis of task switching gestures is as silly as trying to differentiate based on copy/paste. Ten geeks will line up on day one. The rest of the world will not know or care what you are talking about.
  9. #69  
    Quote Originally Posted by kjb86 View Post
    good points all around on your post

    however, with respect to hardware being proficient enough, it all depends on the user and what types of apps they're leaving in the background. I never actually keep any app open. it's just habit to swipe away and be done. That being said, i'm sure anyone who's familiar with PC's know that if you leave heavy intensive applications opened, you will run down your resources (lets say you leave 5 games open, but really, how many people will do that)?
    Thanks...

    Ive taken some time to think about this before I responded, so here goes:

    For me, what makes WebOS so great is that is can multitask, and this is not an obscure effort to literally have 5 or 10 apps open at the same time - some that I might not use for hours, but, still, I want them, and their state saved because I know I will need them later on in the day, and switch back and forth in between them all day long.

    Conventianally, I will have the phone, calculator, unit converter (I do wish someone would combine both like the built in calculator for the old Treo), accuweather, an internet page or two open, each in separate cards, and, when I travel, the music player apps open at the same time, and perhaps a simple game like solitaire or minesweeper if I have a few minutes to kill in a waiting room or airport.

    Now, with all of those open at once on my Pre+, resources drain and battery life drains, and, if I didnt overclock to 800mhz or higher, it would be kind of unsmooth switching between the cards and opening and closing apps that have been open that long, but, you see, that is my "desktop".. this is what I want available instantly on my smartphone any time I pick it up, and WebOS is close to achieving this, but not quite there yet, due to the resource and battery drain and stock CPU processing power (combined with a lack of the OS being optimized).

    Having said the above, I cant do this, and have to close applications and use one at a time to make sure I dont run out of battery life in a place where I cant recharge, not to mention possibly see a performance hit if I turn off overclocking to extend battery life.

    Now, fix each of the above with enhanced hardware and OS optimizations, and Im a happy camper - because I can leave everything open all day long, smoothly and quickly switch back n forth between apps and even open others and still not feel a performance hit, or see my battery drain so quickly.

    I believe some of this is OS optimization of the code, and as WebOS as a software program matures, this will happen, but, the hardware MUST be able to handle even the most extensive use of this multitasking prowess by even the most novice user, because, lets face it, most people arent tech savy, and will want to leave 10 apps open at once all day long.

    Battery life
    CPU power and speed
    RAM

    These are, IMHO, very, VERY key hardware components that a true multitasking OS like WebOS has to have superior specifications compared to other competitive mobile OS's, so that it always performs quickly, smoothly, and intuitively.

    I guess my point is that if WebOS is THE multitasking OS, it has to be able to have the hardware resources and optimizations to perform so well that it stands above every competing OS that tries to multitask as a secondary feature, and then still compete in all of the other aspects of the OS.

    Having said that, Im not sure the PalmPad has the specs for that, given the larger screen size and the leaked processing power, RAM and battery life... I might be wrong, though, if the specs leaked are old and outdated, OR, if HP has done an incredible job of optimizing the OS with the hardware.

    Last edited by LCGuy; 01/29/2011 at 08:58 AM.
    "The more I learn, the more I realize just how little I really do know!" -Albert Einstein

  10. #70  
    Quote Originally Posted by astraith View Post
    I think saying that the multitasking didn't do well last time is kinda a moot point. Can you prove to me why the people who did not buy a Palm Pre didn't care about multitasking? Or could it be they didn't realize what multitasking on a Pre could benefit them? It goes back to marketing, it was horrible and didn't show their customers why they need WebOS to live. Why should people care when you don't tell them why they shoudl care?
    There are many things that accounted for the failure of the Pre last time. Cards multitasking wasn't really one of them. It's pretty great, actually. But that's one of the few known positives of this platform. The point is that there are so many others that are so overwhelmingly negative, you would probably want to focus on the vast improvement in those areas (e.g. hardware, lack of apps, lack of ecosystem) rather than one in which you are ahead of the competition that simply makes the phone more convenient to use at times.

    Microsoft is utilizing that very same strategy on another tarnished brand (e.g. Windows Phone) relaunched with "new apps" on "sexy new hardware", and it's not gaining a significant amount of traction. Why would HP duplicate that same promotional effort and dilute that message even further?

    Then why is Apple changing their OS to add gestures -- so you can multitask and switch your applications quickly and easily? If people don't care about it, why would Apple care about doing that? Don't tell me you believe Apple is just coping Palm... do you?

    Of course you don't, and of course normal people want to multitask. It is HP/Apple's job to tell you why you should care. Any one who has worked in sales would tell you this is true.
    To the extent that the vast majority of people care, Apple and Android's platforms are good enough. More than good enough. Especially with the mountain of other positives they have over smaller, up-and-coming platforms. The window for cards multitasking to be a blockbuster feature closed some time ago. Now, it's a commodity that almost every platform shares in some form or another. But there are many, many, many things that HP's platform doesn't share AT ALL with the competition, and that is where their focus should be.
  11. #71  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    What tech product do you know of that is announced, and immediately available for purchase? I don't recall any, but I suppose there could be some...
    i know the evo, and usual the iphone is, but Im confused with your question, because HP like any company can keep things quiet (with or without leaks) then announce something on one day and launch it the next. How is that hard to believe? So pretty much lets say a product is supposed to be out march 13th instead of announcing it in january you announce it say the first week of march.
  12. #72  
    Quote Originally Posted by LCGuy View Post
    Thanks...

    Ive taken some time to think about this before I responded, so here goes:

    For me, what makes WebOS so great is that is can multitask, and this is not an obscure effort to literally have 5 or 10 apps open at the same time - some that I might not use for hours, but, still, I want them, and their state saved because I know I will need them later on in the day, and switch back and forth in between them all day long.

    Conventianally, I will have the phone, calculator, unit converter (I do wish someone would combine both like the built in calculator for the old Treo), accuweather, an internet page or two open, each in separate cards, and, when I travel, the music player apps open at the same time, and perhaps a simple game like solitaire or minesweeper if I have a few minutes to kill in a waiting room or airport.

    Now, with all of those open at once on my Pre+, resources drain and battery life drains, and, if I didnt overclock to 800mhz or higher, it would be kind of unsmooth switching between the cards and opening and closing apps that have been open that long, but, you see, that is my "desktop".. this is what I want available instantly on my smartphone any time I pick it up, and WebOS is close to achieving this, but not quite there yet, due to the resource and battery drain and stock CPU processing power (combined with a lack of the OS being optimized).

    Having said the above, I cant do this, and have to close applications and use one at a time to make sure I dont run out of battery life in a place where I cant recharge, not to mention possibly see a performance hit if I turn off overclocking to extend battery life.

    Now, fix each of the above with enhanced hardware and OS optimizations, and Im a happy camper - because I can leave everything open all day long, smoothly and quickly switch back n forth between apps and even open others and still not feel a performance hit, or see my battery drain so quickly.

    I believe some of this is OS optimization of the code, and as WebOS as a software program matures, this will happen, but, the hardware MUST be able to handle even the most extensive use of this multitasking prowess by even the most novice user, because, lets face it, most people arent tech savy, and will want to leave 10 apps open at once all day long.

    Battery life
    CPU power and speed
    RAM

    These are, IMHO, very, VERY key hardware components that a true multitasking OS like WebOS has to have superior specifications compared to other competitive mobile OS's, so that it always performs quickly, smoothly, and intuitively.

    I guess my point is that if WebOS is THE multitasking OS, it has to be able to have the hardware resources and optimizations to perform so well that it stands above every competing OS that tries to multitask as a secondary feature, and then still compete in all of the other aspects of the OS.

    Having said that, Im not sure the PalmPad has the specs for that, given the larger screen size and the leaked processing power, RAM and battery life... I might be wrong, though, if the specs leaked are old and outdated, OR, if HP has done an incredible job of optimizing the OS with the hardware.


    couldnt have said it better. The reason why I hold on to my pre+ is because I can do these sorts of things with utter ease. Even understanding with very old hardware, and OS I still can do more then everything I need to do every day. I can have notes open when budgeting with 3 internet pages with my diff accounts, the calander and a calculator. I then can advance swipe through them updating bal, and updating my calander. I had a Evo and I couldnt even come close to duplicating these task as fast and as smooth as I can with a almost 2 year old phone, and a un optimized OS. So to me a fully optimized webos(which is what I believe HP/Palm has been up to) with matching upto date hardware and we have more then a competitor, we have a leader IMO.
  13. #73  
    Having been using an Epic for the last few weeks (actually, month and a half, but who's counting?), I'll add that using Android is definitely frustrating vs. using webOS. It's simply not as smooth, elegant, or pleasurable an experience pretty much across the board--what webOS does, it tends to do better than Android.

    However, therein lies the rub for me: "what webOS does..." Today, there are simply too many things that webOS still doesn't do that would make it a viable platform for me at this time. webOS also has a bit more "elegance" because it's a bit simplistic in some areas. I'm sure it will run into some of the same issues as Android as it becomes more complex, although webOS does have a better and more cohesive foundation to work from.

    If I look at webOS purely from a user's perspective, which I've been forced to do recently given some personal and work requirements, then I have to say that it's lacking too many things to be my primary smartphone. Android may not be nearly so elegant or pleasant to use, but it has the apps and capabilities that I need. And, importantly, it's not so bad that it's actually unpleasant to use. If I'd never used webOS, I'd find Android to be just fine on a day-to-day basis.

    As an enthusiast, however, I know that webOS is superior and that once it has all of the apps and capabilities that I need--such as a Nook client, document editing, voice recording, remote access apps, barcode scanners, Shazam, fully fleshed out apps like Evernote, etc., etc.--then I'll be back on the platform in a flash. In fact, I'll pay full price if necessary for the first webOS smartphone that's released with good hardware and an ecosystem (apps and media) that has everything I need.

    To bring this longish post back closer to the point of this thread, then, when will this happen? And will it happen at all? It could happen as soon as a few weeks after 2/9--we could hear about awesome new smartphone hardware to be released on Sprint (another requirement for me) within a few weeks, along with webOS 2.X that will bring the missing capabilities (audio and camera APIs) and certain key apps that have been in development but not yet announced.

    If that's what 2/9 looks like, then I'll be returning the Epic (I have until 2/11 to do so) and will get that smartphone on Sprint. The thing is, I don't expect that to happen, but rather I expect to see a tablet that will be available soon, a smartphone or two that will be available on AT&T and/or Verizon in the next few months (and possibly no word about a Sprint release), key partnerships with, e.g., Amazon, B&N, and others that will bear fruit "in the coming months" or "by the end of the year," and a very long-term cloud services strategy that will be amazing but won't happen for some time.

    Because I can't give up the capabilities I need today to get work done and live my life, I'm fully expecting to be on Android until my Sprint upgrade is available again. That means that I believe webOS will finally be what I need it to be by this time next year. And unlike in the past, I'm simply done waiting for webOS to get there. The fact is, I'd waited long enough already.

    *Note: I'll also be forced to think long and hard about what tablet I should get, if I decide to get one at all. Do I get a webOS tablet even though it might also lack a few things, and I'll have a divergence from the smartphone I'm currently using? Or should I go all-in with Android? I suppose it all depends on just how awesome that tablet is, and whether the key tablet apps (document editing and a Nook client, mainly) are immediately available.
    Treo 600 > Treo 650 > HTC Mogul (*****!) > HTC Touch Pro (***** squared!) > PRE! > Epic
  14. #74  
    Quote Originally Posted by wynand32 View Post
    Having been using an Epic for the last few weeks (actually, month and a half, but who's counting?), I'll add that using Android is definitely frustrating vs. using webOS. It's simply not as smooth, elegant, or pleasurable an experience pretty much across the board--what webOS does, it tends to do better than Android.

    However, therein lies the rub for me: "what webOS does..." Today, there are simply too many things that webOS still doesn't do that would make it a viable platform for me at this time. webOS also has a bit more "elegance" because it's a bit simplistic in some areas. I'm sure it will run into some of the same issues as Android as it becomes more complex, although webOS does have a better and more cohesive foundation to work from.

    If I look at webOS purely from a user's perspective, which I've been forced to do recently given some personal and work requirements, then I have to say that it's lacking too many things to be my primary smartphone. Android may not be nearly so elegant or pleasant to use, but it has the apps and capabilities that I need. And, importantly, it's not so bad that it's actually unpleasant to use. If I'd never used webOS, I'd find Android to be just fine on a day-to-day basis.

    As an enthusiast, however, I know that webOS is superior and that once it has all of the apps and capabilities that I need--such as a Nook client, document editing, voice recording, remote access apps, barcode scanners, Shazam, fully fleshed out apps like Evernote, etc., etc.--then I'll be back on the platform in a flash. In fact, I'll pay full price if necessary for the first webOS smartphone that's released with good hardware and an ecosystem (apps and media) that has everything I need.

    To bring this longish post back closer to the point of this thread, then, when will this happen? And will it happen at all? It could happen as soon as a few weeks after 2/9--we could hear about awesome new smartphone hardware to be released on Sprint (another requirement for me) within a few weeks, along with webOS 2.X that will bring the missing capabilities (audio and camera APIs) and certain key apps that have been in development but not yet announced.

    If that's what 2/9 looks like, then I'll be returning the Epic (I have until 2/11 to do so) and will get that smartphone on Sprint. The thing is, I don't expect that to happen, but rather I expect to see a tablet that will be available soon, a smartphone or two that will be available on AT&T and/or Verizon in the next few months (and possibly no word about a Sprint release), key partnerships with, e.g., Amazon, B&N, and others that will bear fruit "in the coming months" or "by the end of the year," and a very long-term cloud services strategy that will be amazing but won't happen for some time.

    Because I can't give up the capabilities I need today to get work done and live my life, I'm fully expecting to be on Android until my Sprint upgrade is available again. That means that I believe webOS will finally be what I need it to be by this time next year. And unlike in the past, I'm simply done waiting for webOS to get there. The fact is, I'd waited long enough already.

    *Note: I'll also be forced to think long and hard about what tablet I should get, if I decide to get one at all. Do I get a webOS tablet even though it might also lack a few things, and I'll have a divergence from the smartphone I'm currently using? Or should I go all-in with Android? I suppose it all depends on just how awesome that tablet is, and whether the key tablet apps (document editing and a Nook client, mainly) are immediately available.
    well assuming even the smaller tablet was noted to be running on sprints evdo, and the rumors of the latest on sprint to be june running 4G, I dont think we will have any issues of a webos device on sprint. Within my company (I've been told not to mention on here) We have pretty good knowledge that a webos smartphone will be available for all carriers (except Tmobile didnt hear about them yet). It is though exactly what you said its what works for you, and I myself using a EVO for a few months just didnt for me. I think it came down to how you explained it, everything I need (which are very basic) Webos offers. I myself am not in need of a voice recorder (and Im a artist, I have the studio or a laptop for that). I dont need dozens of the same app, though as long as the ones available work Im fine. Im not a huge gamer, what I need pretty much any smartphone will suffice. Though how I use it, and easy it is to use Webos for me just works perfect.
  15. #75  
    Quote Originally Posted by wynand32 View Post
    If that's what 2/9 looks like, then I'll be returning the Epic (I have until 2/11 to do so) and will get that smartphone on Sprint. The thing is, I don't expect that to happen, but rather I expect to see a tablet that will be available soon, a smartphone or two that will be available on AT&T and/or Verizon in the next few months (and possibly no word about a Sprint release), key partnerships with, e.g., Amazon, B&N, and others that will bear fruit "in the coming months" or "by the end of the year," and a very long-term cloud services strategy that will be amazing but won't happen for some time.
    Call me hopeful, but after reading all the articles on P|C and Engadget, I get the feeling HP is going to go all out on the 9th and in March. I'm not sure I agree with the fact that they would launch (at least the tablet) without the support from major application developers like Amazon, B&N, etc. or the whole cloud storage. From what I gather, the whole cloud storage support is one of their big selling points (rumored) for the "new" webOS. It is also rumored that they have 6,000 apps ready for the tablet, although I would love to bite my tongue and they actually pull that off by the 9th.

    I'm on Sprint too and it honestly doesn't look great for us, which stinks but I'll stick with my Evo until June/July, whenever they release the new 4G webOS device for us.

    As far as making HP cool...well, I think it could happen. Not the same "cool" factor that Apple has but something of their own. A lot of people say it will never happen but I'm a firm believer that with good hardware and fantastic marketing, that any company could pull it off. I like some of HP's commercials, not huge on their hardware though. If they can come up with memorable commercials (like that baby zooming down the road in a stroller) then they will catch a lot of people's attention.
  16. #76  
    I'll add this: if there is a fully-featured Nook client and document editing app for the tablet out the door (and not sometime in the future), then I'll definitely get the webOS tablet, no (other) questions asked.
    Treo 600 > Treo 650 > HTC Mogul (*****!) > HTC Touch Pro (***** squared!) > PRE! > Epic
  17. #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by sinsin07 View Post
    ...Maybe because of the wildly popular jailbroken app Activator?
    If that is popular, then wouldn't it be logical to concur from that that many iPhone users want the ability to have more app switching in the way of gestures, ala webos / mac os expose style? Just saying.

    Quote Originally Posted by dandbj13 View Post
    I think you have missed the bigger picture. Apple is not doing any of that to "become" successful. They are adding (optional) gestures four generations later because they already "are" successful. They didn't build their empire on advanced gestures for basic functionality. From my limited observation, most iPhone users don't even use the task switching. They still prefer the original navigation metaphor.

    HP trying to build an empire on the basis of task switching gestures is as silly as trying to differentiate based on copy/paste. Ten geeks will line up on day one. The rest of the world will not know or care what you are talking about.
    I don't miss the bigger picture. Apple is doing what their customers want, and should have done it from day one. It really makes no sense since this style of app switching is something Apple has been using in OS X for a while now. I don't think multitasking is going to be the only feature HP has to offer, but even from the start the bigger feature was synergy. Bringing everything together on one device was a nice feature. Still is. I think you are missing what I was saying. One, having and focusing on multitasking did not lead to the fall of Palm. Even mikah912 agreed with me. Do you think that lead to Palm's death? I didn't think so.

    My second point is that people do enjoy it. Normal people do want this feature. Otherwise, Apple wouldn't bother with it and tons of people wouldn't hack their iPhones to get this functionality. Generally people don't hack a OS to get a feature thats one, provided and Apple wants to give their customers what the obviously want.

    That is really my two main points. If thats me missing the bigger picture, then color me confused. The bigger picture is HP will be showing their features on their own schedule. Right now, the execs go to the features we know about. HP has not yet failed on a mobile front. Palm has. We will see what they have planned.

    But that -- and the larger picture -- does not change the simple fact that multitasking -- and specifically the fast app switching that WebOS allows -- is a popular feature that all WebOS users enjoy and Apple fans want.

    What funny is I totally believe a lot of iPhone users do not use the fast app switch technology Apple has implemented thus far. Why? Because it's not an obvious feature that I didn't even figure out until 2-3 months AFTER the release of the feature. If it's not obvious and someone does not follow all the updates, they will just do what they have always done. And even if they do use it it's quite possible they think it is too hard or too tidious. If they do, they might prefer not to use it.

    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Microsoft is utilizing that very same strategy on another tarnished brand (e.g. Windows Phone) relaunched with "new apps" on "sexy new hardware", and it's not gaining a significant amount of traction. Why would HP duplicate that same promotional effort and dilute that message even further?
    Microsoft is not adding anything new to their smartphones. Sure, Xbox integration is cool but it's not enough. They needed a killer app or feature and they missed the mark. Although, it's still a good platform.

    HP I feel has a hidden ace no one knows about. Their top execs response always talks general and always the same tune. It's either HP believe WebOS was perfect on it's own yet does not want accidentally reveal their "big feature". Of course, I could be wrong. But then again so could the people here who think HP will fail and not bring anything new. It's anyone's guess.

    @ wynand32

    I should add, my friend, that I agree webOS is lacking in many features. I don't want my post to seem like a mindless webOS fan boy. I don't even own a webOS device, nor do I currently use a smartphone (got tired of blackberry went back to feature phone). I do believe, as you, that webOS is surpasses everyone else in terms of flow and over all use, but misses the mark in features and app's. Anyone who believes anything less or more is in correct in my opinion.

    But where we differ is I believe Sprint will get some love and I believe a lot of features will be fixed and added. App support will take time, so you'll probably going to be stuck on Android. Heck, I might be stuck on Android if a webOS phone does not comes to Sprint.

    We shall see.
    Last edited by astraith; 01/29/2011 at 09:05 PM.
  18. jdlashley's Avatar
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    #78  
    I'm impressed. This guy could really do wonders for HP.
  19. #79  
    Quote Originally Posted by astraith View Post
    ...
    I should add, my friend, that I agree webOS is lacking in many features. I don't want my post to seem like a mindless webOS fan boy. I don't even own a webOS device, nor do I currently use a smartphone (got tired of blackberry went back to feature phone). I do believe, as you, that webOS is surpasses everyone else in terms of flow and over all use, but misses the mark in features and app's. Anyone who believes anything less or more is in correct in my opinion.

    But where we differ is I believe Sprint will get some love and I believe a lot of features will be fixed and added. App support will take time, so you'll probably going to be stuck on Android. Heck, I might be stuck on Android if a webOS phone does not comes to Sprint.

    We shall see.
    Seriously (OK, not really, but semi-seriously), if you'd just break down and buy a WebOS device, I'd think you were my like-minded unknown cousin.

    Anyone that thinks their phone is the perfect device for everyone is delusional; and probably narcissistic as well (believing that since it's perfect for them, it must be for everyone). We all have different needs, wants, and expectations.

    Some folks on here would be shocked to learn that WebOS doesn't meet all of my wants or expectations; however, it meets more than any phone I've been able to put my hands on.

    There are some things Android does that I'd like to see on the Pre. I wish it had a logo on the back similar to the iPhone so my daughter and son-in-law would get off my back. OK, OK, I wouldn't mind having the variety of apps that both have either.

    However, I've seen both. Neither would suit me. I make no apologies for that, nor does anyone have to make apologies for what they own. Some folks (my wife is probably one of them, though she has a Pixi) would probably be fine with a feature phone (oops, I forgot, she's hooked on Angry Birds now, nix the feature phone for my wife).

    Truth is, unless Palm/HP offers some strong enterprise solutions in the next 12-18 months, I'm probably going to have a Blackberry in my pocket, whether I want to or not (my employer is going to shove one at me soon, just because they want me to start helping more in that area with our client). But, I digress...

    HP is going to be a player in this arena. At least for the next two years. The Apple fanatics can cry "they're copying and they're crap" all they want; the Android fans can do the same. The fact is that HP has the resources to wedge themselves into the market. Whether or not they will do it succesfully has yet to be seen, but they don't often fail when they really decide to go after something (and no, the iPaq was not a case where they "really decided to go after something", the iPaq was a leftover piece of the Compaq acquisition that HP toyed with for a few years, before deciding to change directions).

    I too believe that there's back door stuff coming from Sprint. I don't know what it is, but my guess is that Sprint is going to announce a new way of offering devices (multi-radio possibly, maybe even probably, or possibly in how they handle multiple data devices on one account), and 2 days later, HP is going to announce (among other things) that they will be the first company offering devices that take advantage of that.

    I know this, February - March is going to be fun in the mobile/small device world.

    Small side note - the developer meeting after the big meeting in February has no more room. So much for "no interest", huh?
  20. #80  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    (and no, the iPaq was not a case where they "really decided to go after something", the iPaq was a leftover piece of the Compaq acquisition that HP toyed with for a few years, before deciding to change directions).
    Even worse, the iPaq was something that HP had to keep alive as something of a necessity; don't forget that HP means to be a one-stop-shop for enterprises. They just wanted to have some sort of smartphone to offer to their clients. The iPaq was it.
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