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  1. #81  
    I would say the criterion for failure was clearly established when Rubinstein repeatedly asserted in earnings calls that Palm had plans for both profitability and continued independence - they achieved neither. WebOS may yet be successful, but Palm clearly and unambiguously failed.
  2. #82  
    Quote Originally Posted by stung View Post
    Yes, you do raise some good points. This really has to do with how you define "failure" and what metrics are used to measure it. For some CEOs, being sold is the end game, and what is considered to be a success. For others, it's not part of the game plan, for example with Groupon and Andrew Mason. I'm curious to use what criteria you use for failure? I have been clear about mine from my 2 previous posts in this thread and I hope I have been clear that these criteria must be filled all together to be considered as failure. I hope I was clear also that failure is not equal to death of a company.
    I don't think "failure" for a company is binary - as in either they failed, or they didn't.

    • Palm failed to maintain their momentum. But then they succeeded in creating a brand name that is still recognized almost a decade and a half later.
    • Ruby and crew failed to full capitalize on the "new Palm" they created, but they successfully created a "new Palm" for whom virtually everyone in the industry had already written an obituary.
    • The "New Palm" failed to make Elevation Partners a ton of money, but they succeeded in making them a small profit.
    • WebOS failed to make Palm a contender again, but succeeded in saving the company from an almost certain extinction.

    So, did Palm achieve success? Without a doubt. Overall is Palm a success - to me yes, because they're still making devices, still selling phones, and still planning on new devices. Are they a bigger success now than they were say six years ago? Of course not. In 2 years, we may say they ultimately failed, but then, we may say they ultimately succeeded as well. My point is, and has been, that the doomcriers are way too premature.
  3. #83  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    I would say the criterion for failure was clearly established when Rubinstein repeatedly asserted in earnings calls that Palm had plans for both profitability and continued independence - they achieved neither. WebOS may yet be successful, but Palm clearly and unambiguously failed.
    Yeah right, clearly and unambiguously to those that want to see it that way. What you decided is "clear" fortunately, doesn't make it so.

    Your case would be made if those were the only assertions that Rubinsetein made. They weren't, they're just the ones you choose to concentrate on - to prove your point.
  4. #84  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Yeah right, clearly and unambiguously to those that want to see it that way. What you decided is "clear" fortunately, doesn't make it so.

    Your case would be made if those were the only assertions that Rubinsetein made. They weren't, they're just the ones you choose to concentrate on - to prove your point.
    Since nothing short of Skynet sending a T-1000 back to the late 80s to take out Jeff Hawkins and Ed Colligan before they could start Palm would constitute failure in your mind, I won't waste another keystroke trying to explain it to you. I stand by what I said as fact. I don't care whether you agree or not. Next...
  5. #85  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Since nothing short of Skynet sending a T-1000 back to the late 80s to take out Jeff Hawkins and Ed Colligan before they could start Palm would constitute failure in your mind, I won't waste another keystroke trying to explain it to you. I stand by what I said as fact. I don't care whether you agree or not. Next...
    And, as usual, you confuse opinion with fact. What you expressed is your opinion, only that, nothing more.

    BTW, I listed as many failures of Palm as I did successes. Time to take the blinders of disappointment and disnenfranchisement. Just because I haven't made a career of dissing Palm doesn't mean I don't recognize they've had failures. I've got a drawer full of older devices that fully represents some of them.
  6. #86  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    And, as usual, you confuse opinion with fact. What you expressed is your opinion, only that, nothing more.

    BTW, I listed as many failures of Palm as I did successes. Time to take the blinders of disappointment and disnenfranchisement. Just because I haven't made a career of dissing Palm doesn't mean I don't recognize they've had failures. I've got a drawer full of older devices that fully represents some of them.
    Ok. Thanks.
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