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  1. #81  
    Quote Originally Posted by chad783 View Post
    Major difference with Windows Mobile and WebOS. Palm had great success with their release of the WebOS platform and had great momentum. But fell short because HP/Palm can't keep that momentum going. Developers jumped off and moved on. It sounds like they are building for what will be the 'big thing' in 2011/2012 which by the time they release it, will be outdated...again. With Windows Mobile, it had been around since Pocket 2000. The were way overdue for an overhaul. Apples and oranges.
    I'd argue that the original relase wasn't a great success. sure they are apples and oranges, but my main point was that a reset is not horrible.

    Lets say they release 2 phones in Feb/March (a pre2 and a slab) as well as a tablet in Feb/March. Then, when the holiday season rolls around next year, we see another new phone(s). and inbetween that we'll see software updates to webos3.0, printers, a watch (?) who knows what else.

    Just because you won't get a new phone for christmas, doesn't mean that Hp Palm/WebOS are dead. If i were a developer, id be stoked to know that within 6 months there will be multiple phones and a tablet to develop for.

    Like Rahul said "You will certainly see products released over the next 12 months, some sooner than others, and some which are very exciting to me. The stuff that excites me the most are the new form factors. Now, when I said "over the next 12 months," I really mean over the next 12 months. Not at the end of 12 months, not tomorrow...but over the next 12 months we will see the makings of a new portfolio and the beginning of something great again. There is no predefined window of opportunity in the technology business; lack of innovation is the only thing that closes the window."
    Moto Razr>>BlackBerry 8703e>>Moto Q>>Blackberry Curve 8330>>Blackberry Storm>>Palm Pre +
  2. #82  
    Yeah, I also think there is some merit to it only being a europe launch in early next year and maybe we can still get a US launch at the end of november/december.
  3. #83  
    The cat is out of the bag...time to make it official HP.
    the longer you wait a kitten dies.
  4. #84  
    I'm an original Sprint Pre user, so I feel i've waited more than long enough. This is my plan: Best Buy is doing a free phone fridays promotion this month... if one of the Sprint phones they offer is the Evo or Epic, i'm going for it. This means that I will be eligible for upgrade again next November, giving Palm plenty of time to release a new phone. If it is good... I will come back. Unless I discover that Android kicks the hell out of WebOS.
  5. #85  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikevillain View Post
    I'm an original Sprint Pre user, so I feel i've waited more than long enough. This is my plan: Best Buy is doing a free phone fridays promotion this month... if one of the Sprint phones they offer is the Evo or Epic, i'm going for it. This means that I will be eligible for upgrade again next November, giving Palm plenty of time to release a new phone. If it is good... I will come back. Unless I discover that Android kicks the hell out of WebOS.
    I feel your pain I'm in the same boat i have a chipped corner on my phone ...hopefully HP makes an official statement soon. Ruby did say we will be getting 2.0 by EOY so hopefully before 2011 we get a new update and then next year we PalmPad and then the phone.
  6. chad783's Avatar
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    #86  
    Quote Originally Posted by callen10 View Post
    I'd argue that the original relase wasn't a great success. sure they are apples and oranges, but my main point was that a reset is not horrible.

    Lets say they release 2 phones in Feb/March (a pre2 and a slab) as well as a tablet in Feb/March. Then, when the holiday season rolls around next year, we see another new phone(s). and inbetween that we'll see software updates to webos3.0, printers, a watch (?) who knows what else.

    Just because you won't get a new phone for christmas, doesn't mean that Hp Palm/WebOS are dead. If i were a developer, id be stoked to know that within 6 months there will be multiple phones and a tablet to develop for.

    Like Rahul said "You will certainly see products released over the next 12 months, some sooner than others, and some which are very exciting to me. The stuff that excites me the most are the new form factors. Now, when I said "over the next 12 months," I really mean over the next 12 months. Not at the end of 12 months, not tomorrow...but over the next 12 months we will see the makings of a new portfolio and the beginning of something great again. There is no predefined window of opportunity in the technology business; lack of innovation is the only thing that closes the window."
    Actually, with all the hacks and running at 1Ghz, my Pre is running really well. My problems is not with the hardware so much (even though the Oreo effect with the orignal Sprint Pre drives me nuts) but with the developers and lack of support to develop quality apps. Adobe was onboard early with Palm and even demoed Flash on the Pre months ago. Where is it? On the Android system. Slingmedia won't even go near webOS. And even CBS jumped ship. The writing is on the wall that the developers won't support this. Palm even made is so simple to develop with the Ares project. Still...nothing.

    Sure...Rahul told is all about on how the new hardware is coming last month and told us that we see it in the next 12 months. Now HP is saying early 2011. So we can make a strong bet that it will be April/May/June before we actually get our hands on it. That is 8 months at the earliest and 10 months since the latest. As a developer, I wouldn't be too excited that my apps wouldn't hit the market until 8-10 months since last word. We all know the market changes in a heartbeat. Even 6 months is a world of difference.

    So I am confident that HP/Palm will come out with a quality product but if you don't get the developers to back it, it is no use. And now that HP/Palm is telling developers to wait 6 months minimum to put their apps in the works, it shows that they don't have them in mind going forward. They are going to develop their own apps for the tablet to get it to launch. But they are going to leave the smartphone community blowing in the wind.
    Sprint Phones owned since Fall of 2001: Samsung I300, Samsung I330, Samsung I500, Treo 600, Treo 650, Treo 700p, Centro, 800w, Palm Pre, Samsung Epic and now the HTC 3D EVO.
  7. #87  
    I really, REALLY hate nonspecific phrases like "early 2011" - that can mean any time before June 30 if at all. Remember Flash & DocsToGo.

    If they really mean "early" 2011 they should be able to narrow that to a specific month.
    My device history:

    - Jim J.

    (On Sprint for many years)
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    #88  
    Quote Originally Posted by jjeffcoat View Post
    I really, REALLY hate nonspecific phrases like "early 2011" - that can mean any time before June 30 if at all. Remember Flash & DocsToGo.

    If they really mean "early" 2011 they should be able to narrow that to a specific month.
    They do that so they don't get in trouble when they break their promise. (learned from past mistakes) It leaves it open for error. Meaning...they don't have anything concrete so that is why they left it that wide open. If they had something more developed, they would be more specific in their timeframe.
    Sprint Phones owned since Fall of 2001: Samsung I300, Samsung I330, Samsung I500, Treo 600, Treo 650, Treo 700p, Centro, 800w, Palm Pre, Samsung Epic and now the HTC 3D EVO.
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    #89  
    I haven't posted in a while but have been keeping up with PreCentral. I love WebOS, but moved to the Epic on 9/1.
    It's a superb of hardware, but I dearly miss WebOS. Especially being able to install patches for customization instead of full roms.
    But I'll take a slightly different tack on the main difference to me.
    The WebOS developers and community. WebOS is like family. Most everyone helping each other and striving to improve each individual experience. In Android there seems to be just a few developers working on roms and there seems to be very limited access to the OS itself. Whereas WebOS invites developers and users to dig in much deeper to actually improve the OS itself. And I've found quite a bit more "attitude" with Android forum moderators than I ever saw in PreCentral.

    So, if the flagship of the HP-Palm line, when released, is at least on hardware as good as the Epic, with or without a slider keyboard and hopefully with the coming dual-core processors, then I'll get it on Sprint.
    Even if it's before my next upgrade (July 1st, 2011), I'll probably try to upgrade then.

    I still fire up the Pre once a week or so to see what updates there are and remind myself how much more elegant and intuitive WebOS is.
  10. #90  
    to all the developers posting here, how do you know there are no new palm devices coming out this year?

    all we were told was that new phone(S) would be coming out early 2011, via a statement by an HP exec in EUROPE. We were not told that a new phone won't be coming out in the US this year.

    I know there is a NDA...but perhaps precentral wouldn't post anything about a palm "mansion" unless they had a really credible source...like perhaps mention of the mansion in some of the code of webOS 2.0,similar to how the palm "eos" was discovered?

    hp I think will release palm's new device sometime this year, to accompany 2.0...and then release more phones and devices early next year, both in the US and worldwide soon after.
  11. #91  
    The fact that Palm devices have, at this point, 0% market awareness and no current traction actually makes it easier for HP to wait until CES or whenever to release a new phone. Palm, in their minds, may have already bottomed-out so they might as well do the new release the way thay want to and at the time they want to. Sure they will lose some current pre people and developers may stop doing anything except start preparing things for 2.0 but they will still have a better base than if they had started a phone from scratch on their own.

    Given the size of HP, I think that developers will flock to the new device once it is released so, although we may find ourselves with not much new for a while, I think they will be back.

    In a sense they are totally "rebooting" Palm with the exception that they have a great and tested OS behind them so the new devices shouldn't have the birth-pangs that happen with a new OS.

    Here's and interesting one though -- Has anyone thought of the possibility that new Apps and OS's for the new phone will not be backwardly compatable with pre's and pixies? Wouldnt surprise me at all if that happens and Pre users get orphaned.
  12. mike5's Avatar
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    #92  
    Quote Originally Posted by UntidyGuy View Post
    Other than the fact that Rahul opens his mouth, is there any particular reason to follow what he says as gospel? He works for a company that has zero percent mindshare in the smartphone category in their existing product line (iPaq) and their newly acquired one (Palm). You know what closes the window? Lack of product.
    Has Rahul said anything incorrect? Paraphrasing...

    >>>Nothing imminent. Multiple devices w/in the next 12 months. Not at the end of 12 months, but during the 12 months. Love the hardware/form factors. Those who have left will want to come back. webOS is the best. The Palm community is a very passionate group.<<<

    Sounds pretty honest to me. What has been incorrect is our community dissecting every word he says, at times out of context, and adding our own (desired) meaning to his words.
  13. #93  
    Quote Originally Posted by midmofan View Post
    The fact that Palm devices have, at this point, 0% market awareness and no current traction actually makes it easier for HP to wait until CES or whenever to release a new phone. Palm, in their minds, may have already bottomed-out so they might as well do the new release the way thay want to and at the time they want to. Sure they will lose some current pre people and developers may stop doing anything except start preparing things for 2.0 but they will still have a better base than if they had started a phone from scratch on their own.

    Given the size of HP, I think that developers will flock to the new device once it is released so, although we may find ourselves with not much new for a while, I think they will be back.
    Why is that? Microsoft is a bigger deal, and even they are having to resort to financial guarantees and assembling a "developer outreach team" to get a decent stable of launch apps for WP7. And keep in mind, they've been working at this with finished developer tools for some time. Neither HP nor WebOS has made moves anywhere near that effective as of yet.

    In a sense they are totally "rebooting" Palm with the exception that they have a great and tested OS behind them so the new devices shouldn't have the birth-pangs that happen with a new OS.

    Here's and interesting one though -- Has anyone thought of the possibility that new Apps and OS's for the new phone will not be backwardly compatable with pre's and pixies? Wouldnt surprise me at all if that happens and Pre users get orphaned.
    Would be instant suicide to start from scratch and orphan 4K apps and 2 million or so users worldwide.
  14. mike5's Avatar
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    #94  
    Quote Originally Posted by chad783 View Post
    Sure...Rahul told is all about on how the new hardware is coming last month and told us that we see it in the next 12 months. Now HP is saying early 2011. So we can make a strong bet that it will be April/May/June before we actually get our hands on it. That is 8 months at the earliest and 10 months since the latest. As a developer, I wouldn't be too excited that my apps wouldn't hit the market until 8-10 months since last word. We all know the market changes in a heartbeat. Even 6 months is a world of difference.
    Again someone misstates what Rahul said. He said there would be a number of devices over the next 12 months. He said, not tomorrow & not at the end of 12 months, but over the period of 12 months. So your assumption it will be 8-10 months, though possible, I don't believe for a second as probable. Certainly, not from what Rahul said or what the European official said today. I expect, from the comments, to see something in the 1st quarter--they have said the pad will be in the 1st quarter. At the LATEST, this would be 6 months from Rahul's comments.

    They may very well have the pad, a phone, & a printer done by the end of the 1st quarter. That is 3 devices w/in 6 months.

    The only thing holding developers back, IMO, is some of them may want to make money. They tend to make money on devices that have been sold in large numbers. This hasn't happened yet for the Pre, but if I developed, I would have a little more confidence in a company that has as wide a distribution chain as any company in the world & a full product line where my apps could sell.
  15. #95  
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike5 View Post
    The only thing holding developers back, IMO, is some of them may want to make money.
    Oh, just that?
  16. #96  
    Us sprint users are frustrated because we have a very poorly built phone....web os is great but the palm pre is probably the worst phone I've owned... Dnt get me wrong I love it otherwise I wouldn't still have it ( got it on release day) but I went through 1 centro in 2 yrs I'm on my 4th palm pre and 3rd battery... If the speaker doesn't pop the keyboard stops working.. Ect. Making me have to go argue at sprint for a new one....now this usb crack won't let me get one w/o paying insurance.. Do yes we are frustrated...lol
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    #97  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Oh, just that?
    Sure there are other reasons depending on the developer, but I think that the Pre not being as wide spread as the Apple or Android devices IS a major factor. If you wanted to sell a product for a living, do you sell to the one w/30 million customers or the one w/maybe a million? Those are made up numbers, but you understand the principle.

    I think if the Pre had a comparable customer base as Apple and Android have, I don't think webOS would have about 1/20th of the apps.

    Do you?
  18. #98  
    I am sort of relieved. I don't want a Pre Plus / Pre X / Pre 2 all released in the same year on the same carrier (*wink* verizon i'm looking at you) like clockwork every 3 months. The availability of dual core arm cpus will not land until next year anyways. For those of us that are buying into the whole multitasking paradigm, it's probably best that the successor have an extra cpu core.
  19. #99  
    This caught my eye:

    "For example, if you open Angry Birds and then switch to your e-mail, you have to completely start Angry Birds up again."

    For reals? On the iPhone - which as we know, doesn't really "multitask" - you can totally leave AB and go back to it, mid throw if it needs to.
  20. #100  
    Quote Originally Posted by UntidyGuy View Post
    Other than the fact that Rahul opens his mouth, is there any particular reason to follow what he says as gospel? He works for a company that has zero percent mindshare in the smartphone category in their existing product line (iPaq) and their newly acquired one (Palm). You know what closes the window? Lack of product.
    I don't think you get it. HP does not care about the current user base, in fact, like someone else mentioned, only us, Sprint Pre launch customers are eligible for an upgrade. HP CAN gain mind-share in a heart beat, this is HP we are talking about not Apple or Google. I agree with what HP is doing, they need a big splash and a reset and that's exactly what they are doing.

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