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  1. #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by NitOxYs View Post
    Considering Palm released developers the first beta, when they have WebOS 2.0 almost completed right now fyi. They wanted some developers to have a taste of what the WebOS 2.0 had packed in. If you think what was given to developers is what Palm has done, you're clearly mistaken. They've been working on WebOS 2.0 since the beginning of 2010. Apparently about 90% of the developing staff at Palm was put on WebOS 2.0 before they were taken over by HP.
    Glad somebody else said it. Palm did not recently release the beta of WebOS 2, they recently released the beta of the SDK for WebOS 2. I know that may sound like a minor difference, but it's really not. They have been testing internally for some time, and you can just about bet that with HP in charge now, they have far greater internal testing capabilities.

    I suspect we're going to see action quicker now that they're owned by HP.
    Last edited by hparsons; 09/07/2010 at 03:06 PM.
  2. #62  
    cmon hp webos 2.0 is looking really good, release some hardware that's just as sexy asap
  3. #63  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Glad somebody else said it. Palm did not recently release the beta of WebOS 2, they recently released the beta of the SDK for WebOS 2. I know that may sound like a minor difference, but it's really not. They have been testing internally for some time, and you can just about bet that with HP in charge now, they have far greater internal testing capabilities.

    I suspect we're going to see action quicker now that they're owned by HP.
    I didn't really think about the difference when I posted that regarding the beta SDK just coming out. At first I was very concerned, as there is a lot that isn't in the SDK yet, but they were smart in that they released the stuff with big impacts first, and the new features are coming in later SDK versions.
  4. susanoo26's Avatar
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    #64  
    I think there will be a big announcement soon......but my gut tells me that announcement will come in the form of a tablet first.
    Everything seems to be pointing towards that. The only move they (HP) seems to be making is in the direction of the PalmPad which will be unveiled early 2011
  5. #65  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Glad somebody else said it. Palm did not recently release the beta of WebOS 2, they recently released the beta of the SDK for WebOS 2. I know that may sound like a minor difference, but it's really not. They have been testing internally for some time, and you can just about bet that with HP in charge now, they have far greater internal testing capabilities.

    I suspect we're going to see action quicker now that they're owned by HP.
    While I agree that HP would pretty much have to be able to internally execute than a on-its-last-legs Palm, I'm not sure people are going to be dazzled by their speed to market. Even with Palm supposedly envisioning WebOS on form factors like tablets from the get go, HP couldn't give a launch window quicker than Q1 2011 (aka 6+ months after the acquisition was completed) for their tablet.

    That puts them way, way, way behind the iPad 1.0 and maybe even behind iPad 2.0, and also behind the Galaxy Tab which will have subsidies from multiple carriers and be out in time for Christmas, not to mention behind the Motorola/Verizon tablet and so and so forth.

    Now, if that's the quickest they can execute on tablets, and they've actually set a release date for that, how fast are they moving on smartphones when they don't have even the slightest sighting of new hardware yet?

    Nothing against them, per se. But consider that Samsung - the company that's pulled off the best coordinated multi-carrier launch of a smartphone in sometime - announced the Galaxy S in March, and couldn't get it to market until June...in EUROPE AND ASIA, where they didn't have to go through any carrier customization and approval of firmware. It took them another month to get through those hurdles to launch of AT&T and T-Mobile. Yet another 1.5-2 months to get it through Sprint and Verizon. And it wasn't like that time was spent adding new features to TouchWiz or adding Froyo, or even securing carrier agreements. They already had all of that in place. Just putting out the software and featureset they announced in March with enough inventory took months, and they do most of their own manufacturing (e.g. Super AMOLED screen).

    HP/Palm is behind Motorola, Samsung, and Apple in the Cortex ARM chip pecking order. Screens are in tight supply no matter which technology you go with (Super TFT, IPS, whatever). Even if they've assembled lots of pieces in place and kept them close to the vest, so to speak, I don't see HP moving but so fast when rivals with more advantages took months to bring their product to market after announcement. And there are only three months left in 2010. Whether Palm announces or not, new Windows Phone 7 and Android handsets and lots of Android tablets ARE launching with product that people are already planning to buy now.
  6. #66  
    I hope you are right, vince. We all do.
  7. #67  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    ... And there are only three months left in 2010. Whether Palm announces or not, new Windows Phone 7 and Android handsets and lots of Android tablets ARE launching with product that people are already planning to buy now.
    I totally agree with you, but don't you think if HP wants something, they will go get it? Think of the company they went to a bidding war with. They doubled Dell's original bid and eventually bought the company. They are a HUGE corporation. And, I have a feeling palm has been ordering the necessary items for a while now. If random Chinese companies can get their hands on 4 inch, 960x640 displays, HP can too.
  8. asharrop's Avatar
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    #68  
    @Mikah Your comments are wildly speculative. Making claims like HP is behind certain companies in a 'pecking order' for chip makers is completly false. Also, just because something else comes out first doesn't mean it will be the most successful.

    Granted the holiday season will be a big push for the competition, but I heard the governments are already planning on more holiday seasons the following year. I haven't confirmed that yet though...
  9. #69  
    @rahulsood:I have a very full schedule at @palm tomorrow. Phew, it'll be a long day, but looking forward to it!

    about 3 hours ago via Twitter for iPad
  10. drexaljim's Avatar
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    #70  
    lose the ipad rahulsood
  11. #71  
    Quote Originally Posted by Riboflavin View Post
    @rahulsood:I have a very full schedule at @palm tomorrow. Phew, it'll be a long day, but looking forward to it!

    about 3 hours ago via Twitter for iPad
    Well, I know who I will be twitter stalking tomorrow during school
  12. #72  
    Oh, cut Rahul some slack on the iPad. I'm sure he'll have a Palm Pad when it comes out. And it's a good idea for everyone at HP to play with the iPad to know the bare minimum of what they have to come up with!
  13. #73  
    I've got high hopes!

  14. #74  
    Quote Originally Posted by Riboflavin View Post
    @rahulsood:I have a very full schedule at @palm tomorrow. Phew, it'll be a long day, but looking forward to it!

    about 3 hours ago via Twitter for iPad
    Wonder if hes read us reading his tweets thinking a annoucement is coming. He probley just gets a little laugh as we all go nutz trying to figure out whats going on in the silent hp camp.
  15. #75  
    Quote Originally Posted by Schmid7y View Post
    I totally agree with you, but don't you think if HP wants something, they will go get it? Think of the company they went to a bidding war with. They doubled Dell's original bid and eventually bought the company. They are a HUGE corporation. And, I have a feeling palm has been ordering the necessary items for a while now. If random Chinese companies can get their hands on 4 inch, 960x640 displays, HP can too.
    I haven't seen a KIRF yet with a capacative IPS display with pixel density like the iPhone 4. Not even close. Apple even put a lower quality screen on the new iPod Touch.

    HP may have money and influence galore, but Motorola is and has been the premiere customer for Texas Instrument OMAP chips. They sold more smartphones last quarter (2.7 mil) than there are WebOS devices in existence in five quarters on the market. Palm is still selling Pre Pluses made last year for the Verizon launch. Motorola is already burning through the fastest OMAP 3 chips, and supposedly has designs on the OMAP4 for their Verizon tablet and possibly even a Droid Pro.

    This isn't to say it's impossible. But I find it highly unlikely with every other giant like HTC, Motorola, and even Apple facing tight supply relative to the individual demand for their product that HP, by virtue of simply spending money, can jump the line on proven customers with large orders and consistent sellthrough. But that is simply my opinion.
  16. #76  
    Quote Originally Posted by asharrop View Post
    @Mikah Your comments are wildly speculative. Making claims like HP is behind certain companies in a 'pecking order' for chip makers is completly false.
    Just so I am clear here, with Apple selling every iPhone 4 they make, you think their IPS screen supplier(s) is going to downplay their relationship to divert a million or two so to HP and Palm because they have money? Samsung's got SuperAMOLED on lock, and is grabbing Super TFT/IPS screens for the Samsung Tab. That leaves HP and Palm fighting at the same trough of Super LCD and regular TFT as everyone else.

    Also, just because something else comes out first doesn't mean it will be the most successful.
    In the case of Motorola, Samsung, and Apple's flagship handsets, we're talking about products that are already successful. As far as tablets, that game still has lots of play left, but there's already a wildly successful product there, and Motorola and Samsung are leveraging their phone successes for their tablets.

    HP and Palm are leveraging an as-yet unsuccessful product and doing so after their competitors. Not impossible, but not a cakewalk for any company of any size and talent pool either.
  17. asharrop's Avatar
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    #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Just so I am clear here, with Apple selling every iPhone 4 they make, you think their IPS screen supplier(s) is going to downplay their relationship to divert a million or two so to HP and Palm because they have money? Samsung's got SuperAMOLED on lock, and is grabbing Super TFT/IPS screens for the Samsung Tab. That leaves HP and Palm fighting at the same trough of Super LCD and regular TFT as everyone else.



    In the case of Motorola, Samsung, and Apple's flagship handsets, we're talking about products that are already successful. As far as tablets, that game still has lots of play left, but there's already a wildly successful product there, and Motorola and Samsung are leveraging their phone successes for their tablets.

    HP and Palm are leveraging an as-yet unsuccessful product and doing so after their competitors. Not impossible, but not a cakewalk for any company of any size and talent pool either.
    I have heard of AMOLED screen shortages. Never once have I read anywhere that there was a supply shortage compared to the demand of other screen types. I'm not saying that you're wrong, but to me it sounds like you're making an assumption here. Do you have an article that speculates this I can read, a quick google search brought up nothing. I think the non-amoled screens will be fine enough to get Palm theirs....

    I agree with the fact that things will be an uphill battle though. I think getting a tablet pc out before the holidays would have helped a lot, but in the end I think WebOS will be a growing and supported platform for years to come. That's really all that matters to me in the end...
  18. #78  
    Rahul said he has been running full webOS 2.0 for a while and we will be pleasantly surprised (it was on facebook tonight). I expect he is twittering from his iPad because his Palm Pad and new phone are on webOS 2.0 and can't be used for public contact yet. Just speculation.
  19. Cringer's Avatar
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    #79  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post

    In the case of Motorola, Samsung, and Apple's flagship handsets, we're talking about products that are already successful. As far as tablets, that game still has lots of play left, but there's already a wildly successful product there, and Motorola and Samsung are leveraging their phone successes for their tablets.
    Today's biggest deal in mobile phones in next month's also-ran. Tablets will end up the same rate, especially when Android is involved. Palm doesn't need to rush something out to day to compete with todays products. They need to make sure their product in a few months or six months will compete then. Coming out with something now or in six months really won't have a huge effect in the life cycle of webOS IMO. This is not a sprint, this is the computer gadget world. Atari is not a player in the console market still, neither is Sega. Amiga is not the name on my laptop, nor is it Tandy. This stuff is a marathon. Some continue on, some survive. Apple has survived a long time in the gadget/computer world....oh and so has HP. They will do well doing things their way.
  20. #80  
    Quote Originally Posted by Cringer View Post
    Today's biggest deal in mobile phones in next month's also-ran. Tablets will end up the same rate, especially when Android is involved. Palm doesn't need to rush something out to day to compete with todays products. They need to make sure their product in a few months or six months will compete then. Coming out with something now or in six months really won't have a huge effect in the life cycle of webOS IMO. This is not a sprint, this is the computer gadget world. Atari is not a player in the console market still, neither is Sega. Amiga is not the name on my laptop, nor is it Tandy. This stuff is a marathon. Some continue on, some survive. Apple has survived a long time in the gadget/computer world....oh and so has HP. They will do well doing things their way.
    Hey, Sony is a giant that's been around forever, too. How are they doing in the phone market? Toshiba is a consumer electronics giant. How are they doing in the smartphone world? For that matter, how has HP done with the iPaq line?

    Surviving and even thriving doesn't mean that they are better positioned than someone else for success in the smartphone "doing things their way".

    How could them releasing a product soon after several months of Palm inactivity, and them having acquired Palm months ago be considered "rushing"? I, too, want them to put out a superior product, but I am merely observing that it has to be balanced with making it to market promptly as well. Their Sprint base is getting signed up to Evo and Epic two-year (one year with a Premier plan) contracts left and right. There is no real Verizon or ATT base, and the stock on those carriers continues to languish despite HP actually paying people with gift cards to take them.

    "Taking time" with a product doesn't really assure anything. They announced the Pre in January, and then said they'd release it sometime in the first half of the year, when it was more ready. Well, despite those six months, WebOS 1.0 was NOT ready, the hardware was not ready, and on top of that, they lost a lot of buzz which went to the iPhone 3GS. The Droid sucked up all of the Verizon oxygen similarly. Nobody here wants to see history repeat.
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