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  1. #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by KJ78 View Post
    I'm not sure why they aren't selling. The public just seems to want 'an Iphone' not realizing there are better 'Iphones' out there. The general economy can't be helping things.
    Thats not true and very fanboyish. The first thing I hear from people is that it feels plasticy and creaky. Second thing is the keyboards too small. Third is that its confusing (from older people mainly)

    The iphone has great build quality, best virtual keyboard made, and is dumb-proof with a simple one click interface to go into an app and out.


    And about this news... Time to buy stock?

    Selling my Palm things: just make an offer: http://forums.webosnation.com/market...nd-offers.html
  2. #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by UntidyGuy View Post
    Here's a more realistic case:

    Phone sales are weak.
    Palm does not have any other products to fall back on.
    Sprint sales were disappointing.
    Verizon sales are disappointing.
    There's absolutely no reason to think that the Pre and Pixi will be more compelling on AT&T sitting next to the iPhone and the Devour or whatever droid phone they will have.
    Developers? Let's just say that there probably aren't going to be a lot of WebOS projects starting up from here on out. I'm thinking that Docs-To-Go for WebOS project is on hold indefinitely.

    Somebody like Dell or HP wants to get into the mobile space. They would buy Palm but they want it at a bargain because the devices aren't that competitive right now.
    That's pretty much exactly it. If they're making the exact same amount of revenue that they did last quarter despite launching TWO new devices on America's largest carrier and porting over a bunch of iPhone games this quarter, it's time to call it:

    The Pre and Pixi are done.

    Launching these same two devices that have underperformed on two carriers on ATT and possibly T-mobile will not change things. Flash will not change things. Video recording will not change things. These are two features every non-iPhone competitor will have or already have. These brand names are not getting the job done, and it's time to admit that.
  3. #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by Crackbone View Post
    Because, the early adopters who could've purchased the phones didn't. They went other directions. Palm lost a large base of the early word of mouth advertising by failing on point 1 and 3.
    The early adopters aren't your normal consumer. Again, the early adopter knew about the phone b/c they follow the tech sites. Your average consumer only knows what her or she sees on tv or what they see someone carrying.
    Are you trying to hurt me?
  4. #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by playboy View Post
    The early adopters aren't your normal consumer. Again, the early adopter knew about the phone b/c they follow the tech sites. Your average consumer only knows what her or she sees on tv or what they see someone carrying.
    My point is, we are in a market now where the early adopters drive the sales, then followed up by mass market advertising. This isn't 2006.

    And you've proven my point, what they see people carrying... no one has seen anyone carry Pres from the beginning...

    Get the early adopters talking about the phones, carrying the phones, etc, and there you go.

    Palm's brand recognition has been a big fat failure from day 1.
  5. #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    That's pretty much exactly it. If they're making the exact same amount of revenue that they did last quarter despite launching TWO new devices on America's largest carrier and porting over a bunch of iPhone games this quarter, it's time to call it:

    The Pre and Pixi are done.

    Launching these same two devices that have underperformed on two carriers on ATT and possibly T-mobile will not change things. Flash will not change things. Video recording will not change things. These are two features every non-iPhone competitor will have or already have. These brand names are not getting the job done, and it's time to admit that.
    Yep, i agree. Time to EOL and try again with a new handset. But i don't think Palm has that left in them and the carriers wouldn't be too crazy about giving webOS a second chance.

    Once again, if they'd stayed with Sprint exclusively, these things could've been ironed out. Eh..shoulda woulda coulda. Palm is small but there is still no reason to be making that many stumbles all around.
  6. #46  
    I'm really losing faith in Palm at this point: I think WebOS is great but they are taking too long to make upgrades. The window of opportunity is closing and it feels like they don't care.

    1. Marketing stinks! Palm didn't spend enough money and what they did spend was flushed down the toilet with ridiculous commercials. It doesn't take an genious to realize the device needed a hip, upbeat marketing campaign that focusses on the capabilities of the device. (The Touchstone should've been a keystone of the campaign and included with the device) Whoever designed and approved the creepy girl commercials probably did more damage to Palm and WebOS than all the other issues combined.

    2. Hardware issues shouldn't have been an issue to begin with, but after this much time there is no excuse for not upgrading things outside of minor tweaks. I agree with above, people don't find plastic screen acceptable any more in high end devices. The screen size is barely adequate in todays standards as well.

    3. The Touchstone is great but should have been bundled with the phone from day 1. Instead of leveraging a standout capability of the Pre, Palm decided to try and profit by selling it separate with a ridiculous markup. This would have also eased a lot of concerns with battery life by making it so easy to charge. FAIL!

    4. Software updates aren't addressing basic needs fast enough. It has taken too long to add video recording and Palm isn't doing enough to entice developers to create core apps. People want a better facebook app for instance and despite the stubborn view of many that palm isn't responsible, they should be if they want customers.

    5. This last one is all speculation but it really seems like Verizon purposely buried Palm. (I blame Palm for allowing it to happen) Seems like they demanded exclusive upgrades, waited forever to release it and then marketed the device with yet another creepy girl. All the while laughing at the early adopters on Sprint who can't even launch their new $10 games without a "too many cards open error".
    Last edited by jeremy3721; 02/25/2010 at 10:39 AM.
  7. #47  
    Sprint would still accept a high-end WebOS handset, I'm sure. Verizon will probably not bother with WebOS any further. Curious to see if this changes AT&T's plans by making their launch a supersoft one.

    But if Palm ever had the means to unleash this mythical C40, it's gotta be now or literally never.
  8. gbp
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    #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    Palm's been a good short. Nothing like a good scary article in the WSJ to drive it down. I might actually play around get some Palm stock to sell before palm's conference call in March. Rebuy in April, sell again after AT&T launch.
    +1
    You spoke my words. The "not long term" folks in Wall street can't wait that long. They want to take their money out and make profit somewhere. I remember the other thread a guy was beating to death the point of having 130 million left. Which is not true. The half billion they have will definitely get them thru this year and next.
  9. #49  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Sprint would still accept a high-end WebOS handset, I'm sure. Verizon will probably not bother with WebOS any further. Curious to see if this changes AT&T's plans by making their launch a supersoft one.

    But if Palm ever had the means to unleash this mythical C40, it's gotta be now or literally never.
    What is new hardware going to do if the lackluster marketing continues? It'll be the same song played over again. New hardware isn't going to get people into the store or give Palm more money to advertise.
    Are you trying to hurt me?
  10. #50  
    Quote Originally Posted by playboy View Post
    What is new hardware going to do if the lackluster marketing continues? It'll be the same song played over again. New hardware isn't going to get people into the store or give Palm more money to advertise.
    1. The hardware was really the only thing ever marketed (Only the very latest Verizon commercials show the OS in closeup). So a Droid-esque slate sold next to the current market leaders might help.
    2. No Oreo issues.
    3. No USB crack issues assuming they aren't stupid enough to keep that port on the side with a plastic cover.
    4. If it's 4G, Sprint would push it big time. Hesse said he's looking for devices with big screens to enhance video content as far as their 4G lineup goes.
    5. Faster hardware would hopefully eliminate lag issues that Palm can't with software.

    I mean, that may very well fail too. But they have to try something.
  11. #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by UntidyGuy View Post
    OK. We're callin' it. FEB 26, 2010. A year and change after the much-heralded launch of WebOS at CES 2009.

    It's been great. Oh, the memories:

    "It only took three days to make Pandora"
    "First half of 2009"
    The guy who got the Pre tattoo
    The lines in front of the Sprint Store
    Homebrew
    Need for Speed leak

    I'm missing a ton, of course, because this was like a reality show on a day to day basis. I'm going to miss the Pre (and the Pixi although I've never actually seen one in person).
    Haha..actually i called the Pixi a bad idea from the start.

    Someone at palm though didn't get the memo on what the word Pre means. As in the 1.0 device that should predate going all out on major carrier launches. It wasn't the device to go big time at Verizon with.

    I'm still surprised Palm didn't have a big screen form factor in mind for big red.
  12. gbp
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    #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    Uh-oh, now Palm is confirming what the analysts have been saying the last few days: Palm sales 'lower than expected,' revenues to miss targets. I'm sure they're scrambling at Palm right now to figure out what's going wrong.
    To the point, Verizon is not pushing Pre. That's what is going wrong.Forget pushing Pre, the sales folks are trash talking about the Pre. I had my own experience in two stores. One imbecile sales guy at Verizon says that Android has more apps than the iPhone. And this guy is not just a regular sales guy , he is an expert senior sales guy specialized in selling smart phones. His only mantra "Droid blows everyphone including the iPhone".

    I used to think SPRINT sales folks are not knowledgeable, but after going to Verizon store comparing them with SPRINT, I have to say SPRINT folks are indeed smart and know their stuff.

    At this point PALM cannot expect a miracle sales movement. IMO, they should stop working on new updates , start a new handset and concentrate on releasing these two phones on every carrier across the globe (with in their capacity). Also , keeping more working phones in the store will help prospective customers in turning towards PALM.
  13. #53  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    Except that these quarterly results include December 2009 which was in the middle of the holiday boom.

    Cash from the sale of even more stock back in September. Stock which has dropped in value by ~50% since then.

    What new OS? The incremental update/bug fix that's supposed to come out this month?

    So, 9 months after the Pre's release, Palm has "stepped up to spend advertising?" Just like last June, Palm doesn't have the money for an ad campaign that is anything more than sparse, sporadic, and on the fringe.

    While I have no insight into Palm's future device plans, I would be dismayed that Palm might invest their limited funds into a preliminary capability hosted by the distant #3 market as a means of increasing their market share. There's a lot of other lower hanging fruit they could go after first.

    Much of Palm's future rests on the whims of Elevation Partners. Remember, Elevation felt no compunction in selling off Bioware and Pandemic Studios after only 2.5 years of non-performance. This year Palm hits that same 2.5 year milestone with Elevation.
    Kupe,

    1) the market trades on forward expectations; last year the market was down to its lows in the cold and sluggishness of March but came up smartly by the fall and those that bought in March made money. I'm not sure if the market's forward view of Palm forged right now in Feb is entirely true; if not, this is when the bold might make money on the stock.

    2) I'm sorry that those who bought the stock last Sept are now seeing a 50% dip. My point was that Palm still has cash to last for awhile.

    3-5)--Your next 3 points are interesting. I meant the update and any apps that are already in the pipe to go along with it--we will have to see how it plays.For advertising--agreed that Palm needs help, we will have to see if Verizon steps up. Regarding June 4G, you make good points and it might be too early to tell.

    6) Elevation partners? Depends on their forecasts about Palm, If they sell now--so soon after launch--I have to believe the price offers will be low as the co is not making money--thus striking a deal may be hard. If Elevation is at all optimistic they may wish to try and fix the problem at Verizon as the phone has been out on that carrier less than a month. I don't know their thinking...

    Again, sorry for the loss of those who bought the stock at high levels. I'm not sure this is an open and shut case yet, it may need to play out a little bit longer.
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    #54  
    one reason I am not worried is that the analysts have a history of being wrong. They just came out with the downgrade now but PALM stock has been down for months. Usually the analysts issue a sell signal at the bottom, the worst possible time.
  15. #55  
    well im sensing some flaming followed by some ban-hammering who's with me?
  16. #56  
    For my part, I bought a hundred shares of PALM stock at $6.50 a share this morning.

    I doubling down on PALM, I don't think they're done just yet. And if they do go down, looks like I'll be going down with them.
  17. #57  
    Quote Originally Posted by brdl04 View Post
    Why did i know 036 would be the first to post!! lol
    because i love these useless threads especially when theyre in the wrong forum
  18. #58  
    nope they shouldve been in palm general not the palm pre forum but maybe you should go ahead and switch to android central but we will all miss your insight
  19. #59  
    Just read this article that came out a few minutes ago. It makes some good points about how Verizon isn't pushing advertising at all for the Pre. Give it a quick read, it's good.

    Palm's Pre isn't the savior investors expected MarketWatch First Take - MarketWatch
  20. #60  
    does that mean Apple will close it's doors too if they start reading our forums?
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