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  1. #21  
    smci, The 650 has been replaced by the 680, which has in turn been replaced by the Centro. Palm does not update ROM or included apps for any model once it has been discontinued (EOL). The 650 has been EOL for a long time. It is entirely inappropriate to compare with any model that did not exist in 2004.

    To think that any business will continue to update any EOL product is economic insanity.

    I hope you enjoy your iPhone and that you will not lose patience waiting for cut and paste.
  2. #22  
    The notion of planned obsolescence is not unique to Palm. It is inherent and endemic to American (and to a lesser extent global) consumerism.

    That's why cars are new every year. That's why Intuit sunsets support on older versions of Quickbooks. That's why Microsoft sunset support on older OS'es.

    Cannibalization of your own customers is one way to look at it. Another way, from a 'sales training' perspective is that 85% of your business comes from prior customers.

    I know lots of folks still doing great with Palm Vx's. (I'm actually a little jealous, that was a spectacular little PDA and I miss my blue Vx sitting sleak in my Palm). One's needs don't always have to expand. I survived for years without ubiquitous web access. Heck, I survived for years without there even being a web.

    The fact that I can do this or that doesn't mean that I need to, or even that being able to do so is necessarily an improvement in productivity.

    So, to circle back to the original point, I would expect Palm, like any other technology company, to make 'end-of-life' miserable for me so that I upgrade.

    Yeah, maybe it's not 'fair,' but you tell me where it says life is fair. It's good business.

    Harold
    Mobile lawyering since 1988: Seiko --> Sharp Wizard --> Sharp Zaurus --> Palm III --> IIIx --> Vx --> m515 --> T|2 --> T|3 --> T|X --> Treo 755p --> HTC Droid Incredible
  3. #23  
    Saying what Palm is doing is "good business" would seem to imply that they are on the right track, which I think a great deal of their own customers (becoming former customers) would disagree.
  4. #24  
    We should always purchase a device aware of how long it has been out and with an idea of the manufacturer's update history. My PDAs have been purchased as such, as have my computers. I never expect anything to be supported for more than a couple of years and if it is, joy to the world.
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by UserOne View Post
    I don't know enough to make claims on OperaMini's popularity among mobile browser users... especially since it seems to be the default browser for other carriers (like AT&T). However, I can say that I tend to prefer Blazer over OperaMini on my 755p for one main reason... OperaMini is simply too unstable on my 755p. Perhaps this is just an issue with my device or other third-party apps I have, but that has been my experience.
    That's generally thought to be a problem with - wait for it - the JVM.
  6. #26  
    I'm a 755P owner, and that's a product that's not end of life.

    But it is a platform that's on its last months, and, if you're an active tinkerer, you can't help but be reminded of that fairly regularly. You watch developers shift their business strategy, or even disappear into Palm, presumably to craft something excellent for Nova. That's nice, but their products are abandoned (see: Chattermail, which you can still buy from Palm, but for which there is no active development, and barely even any bug fixing anymore).

    I understand Palm's business decision to leave the 755p alone. There's no money there.

    But, that does go counter to what I think is a reasonable expectation.

    For example, when Apple released version 2 of its software, that wasn't only for its second generation phones, it was for its first generation phones, as well.

    When Palm released updates to Versamail and Blazer for the Centro, they didn't back port it to the 755P.

    And the JVM? Well, bug fixes and performance work would be nice. But now, if you have to hard reset your device, or need to replace it, you better have kept a copy of the distribution because you can't download it anymore. On the other hand, I can download the critically important Solitaire application from the Palm web site. I know. Licensing, support, money. I get it, but I don't have to like it.

    Let me be clear about something: I know I'm whining. But I also think that Palm's abandonment of an OS platform that it's still selling is a technology transition that's at as unfriendly to customers as any I've ever experienced. That may be necessary from a company that's had a near death experience, but it doesn't make me a happy or loyal customer.
  7. #27  
    There's also something to be said for their outdated hardware even at launch, making even reaching EOL to be more difficult for Palm users (lack of A2DP, non USB 2.0, usually no wifi, no API for google maps for how long?, etc).

    A lot of these problems are specific to their Palm OS phones...
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by smci View Post
    I'm not here to argue with any of you folks, I'm just astonished that you all seem to be happy accepting Palm killing off legacy Treo support BEFORE the Nova replacement for PalmOS is launched.
    Hello? Centro? I'd say it won't hit EOL until mid-09, generally Treo's have at least an 18-24 month life cycle.

    Palm is behind, again, on Nova. But that doesn't mean they can/will 'fill the gap' with another device they hadn't planned on doing. Even if a device is simple refresh it still takes months of preparation and lots of resources, none of which Palm seems to have these days.
  9. #29  
    Even the phones they had a very long time to work on did not release terribly smooth (800w for example). So yeah bridging the gap with a quick release would probably be a disaster.
  10.    #30  
    Re the fairness of the comparison, I'm not comparing to anything with an obsolescence horizon of less than 2-3 years. That rules out Centro. Also, I'm not buying another PalmOS device just to tide me through till Nova appears, for exactly that reason. If Nova was available this Christmas as promised I would happily be migrating to it, but it isn't so I can't. (I certainly hope Palm IS betting the farm on Nova, because it will come in so late it had better have some good features - if not they'll be relegated to the $149 price point and that'll probably kill them. If Nova implements web contact-sync'ing better and/or cheaper than Apple, that would be great.)

    Anyway, I played around with my friend's iPhone a bit, it seemed fine to me, and the browsing, email, mapping and picture album were very impressive.
    Why are people saying iPhone is not good as a phone?
    Got any good links to a side-by-side comparison?
    As far as I know the only downside is the service cost with the wireless carrier, so I'd like to know what typical monthly service cost (data+voice) is with unlocked iPhones.
  11. #31  
    Good luck if you often need to use copy and paste. If not, go for it. You'll be paying the same rates no matter what kind of iPhone you get, locked or unlocked. Although I did read that if you unlock the 1st gen. iPhone and pop in your SIM, you can get all the services except visual voicemail. So you MAY be able to get away with something cheaper on that one. But likely not if you inform AT&T you'll be using an iPhone. Plus I also read AT&T was sending out nice little text "reminders" to people using, I'm going to guess unlocked iPhones, without the iPhone data plan.
    Last edited by The Phone Diva; 09/29/2008 at 10:19 PM.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  12. #32  
    There's a million reviews on the pitfalls/benefits of the iphone all over the place, as well as comparisons to other phones.

    Hardware keyboard is an obvious pitfall that turns off a lot of heavy text/emailers.
  13. #33  
    The OP seems to want to try it. Let him try it and hopefully he can overlook the restrictions and limitations. Others have, he may too. I still need other phones due to the lack of draft saving and copy and paste on the iPhone.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by papped View Post
    There's a million reviews on the pitfalls/benefits of the iphone all over the place, as well as comparisons to other phones.

    Hardware keyboard is an obvious pitfall that turns off a lot of heavy text/emailers.
    The lack of a keyboard makes the iPhone useless to a lot of folks, me included. If the Nova devices aren't too my liking, or never get released, my next smartphone will probably be a Blackberry. I'll hate to leave Palm though.
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    #35  
    Right now my Verizon 755p is hanging in there pretty well but I'm really eager to upgrade to something with AT LEAST a 320x480 screen and better multimedia capabilities. Leaving Verizon is not an option for the time being, due to being on a company-reimbursed plan.

    So sad to say, the BB Storm on VZW is looking like the most likely candidate. Heck, I might even dump the Treo and carry my old TX + the Storm together for a while as I transition.

    Now, if the Storm isn't to my liking (and I have a feeling I will be solely disappointed by some aspect of it that POS still excels in, such as PIM functionality or battery life) then I'll muddle along for a few more months with the 755p and see what '09 brings.
    Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Verizon Treo 700P-->Verizon Treo 755p-->Verizon Motorola Droid + Verizon Centro--> Verizon Motorola Droid X + Palm TX-->Verizon Droid Bionic + Palm TX
  16. #36  
    painful for me to transfer from palm OS to WM now, especially converting data between software.. anyway, byebye palm OS, you have the speed and nice interface, but you cannot catch up with the trend.
  17. #37  
    It would be nice if die-hard Palm OS users could at least see a beta version of Nova so they know hope is coming, but Palm has been SOOOO slow. If people keep moving to other platforms due to getting tired of waiting when all others are releasing stuff NOW, Palm will end up behind even worse than they already are now.

    It's amazing that everone else updates their OS on a regular basis, but not Palm. Even RIM realized they needed to do this and look where they are. They used to be considered a necessary evil for corporate types and they were so boring, but now people actually WANT a BB. People are looking at the constant delays of the AT&T Bold with anguish, LOL! Barely anyone has asked "where's the next Treo?"
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  18. #38  
    Diva, you have to remember that Palm, Inc, only got legal rights to modify Garnet not that long ago. Most of the OS debacle can be laid in the lap of PalmSource (now Access), a separate corporation with other priorities. Palm hasn't owned their OS since 2003. The situation can be considered similar to what HTC is allowed to do to Windows Mobile.

    Palm has said they won't be showing off Nova early for "competitive reasons." I'm sure they will leak when they are ready to do so.
  19. #39  
    That was a BAD move to sell off their own OS, but what about after they got it back? Still no real significant updates, except that now people claim Palm OS on the Centro works the way it should have on Treos in the first place. I'm not sure that's a good thing, it could be taken as Palm FINALLY got it right after too much time crippling Treos.

    Android was shown in an early stage and even WM7 showed up a few times. And WM7 isn't close to being ready either, it seems! Palm should slip out a few shots if they want to get people interested. Because many people don't even seem to think they matter anymore. They need to show that they're still in the game. All these WM and RIM devices coming DO NOT HELP Palm. Many people do not want to wait this long. They will jump ship. The vague 2009 reference isn't helping.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  20. #40  
    LOL! If Apple makes a 3rd generation iPhone with copy and paste and/or draft ability, I may be all over it too!
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
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