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  1.    #1  
    I can not wait until the day when wireless service becomes a commodity similar to landline service. I am beginning to despise the carriers for how they nickel and dime consumers because they know the day of reckoning is near. Here is a case in point. Verizon has a $29.99 unlimited data plan for Centro users but not Treo users. They are sucking us dry for as long as they can. Here is another. What about the charge for text messages? I think it is 15 – 25 cents if you do not have a plan. Does that service really use that much data (a few hundred kb at best) that it warrants such a charge?

    Hopefully Google’s entry into the market later this year will permanently change this dynamic where the consumer has more leverage.
    700P...755...Pre+...Pre 2...Touchpad
  2. fwinst's Avatar
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    #2  
    You have to realize that these providers are doing exactly what landline providers did until something better came along (cellular, VoIP). If the consumer is willing to pay, they're willing to take.
  3. #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by compo View Post
    I can not wait until the day when wireless service becomes a commodity similar to landline service. I am beginning to despise the carriers for how they nickel and dime consumers because they know the day of reckoning is near. Here is a case in point. Verizon has a $29.99 unlimited data plan for Centro users but not Treo users. They are sucking us dry for as long as they can. Here is another. What about the charge for text messages? I think it is 15 – 25 cents if you do not have a plan. Does that service really use that much data (a few hundred kb at best) that it warrants such a charge?

    Hopefully Google’s entry into the market later this year will permanently change this dynamic where the consumer has more leverage.
    lol... offer a good plan like SERO and it does nothing but bring ungrateful and cheap customers... like myself.

    Verizon charges out the nose and people like them....

    You are right though, text is over charged... that is stated over and over... but young people use it and it makes money for the carriers.

    Far as pricing, again, sero does not make sprint any money... not like a customer on a $99 unlimited plan. Sprint has to battle verizon but verizon has much more money. Guess I'm saying, sometimes competition sometimes raises prices. Even more if their are a limited number of companies in the field.

    Oddly enough, I don't think landline service has went down *that* much. You have vonage, but they are struggling financially.

    Not to mention that many VOIP services went out of business.... delivering reliable phone/cell service cost a pretty penny. Maybe carrier costs are justified.

    It is easy to say how much someone should be making to bring a service until you look at the books or have to deal with their financial reports. Not to mention the R&D, new sites, etc that goes into these companies to improve service. These things are not cheap.

    Google won't change anything.

    Hell, what has google changed since inception? (Except for larger email mail boxes.) Consumers don't understand that google makes businesses pay OUT THE NOSE for advertising... that is the only reason CONSUMERS have free search and other free products. Businesses have PAID for that.

    Consumers get the benefit, but businesses pay.

    In addition, google is only making an OS... they won't have an impact either way on the price of the service. Google does not give a crap about you or any other customer, as long as that customer is using their OS to SEARCH. See the connection? They give away the OS for free (like Microsoft did with the browser) so that people will use their cash cow.
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  4.    #4  
    Theog,

    I am a business person and I understand the profit motive of any organization. I think they could be profitable if they lowered the prices and made it more appealing to a wider audience. I can tell you now the average person will not pay close to $100 a month for a cell phone no matter how many bells and whistles it has.

    My main complaint has to do with the stratified pricing. Obviously, VZN thinks they can make money charging $29.99 for unlimited data (Centro) where if you purchased a 755 instead of a Centro you would have to pay at least $39.99. What if you walked into a store and they charged you $2 for a half gallon of milk but the next guy in line got it for $1.50 because he had black hair. Wouldn't you be angry?

    I think that once Wifi becomes more common many people will think twice about paying $480 for internet on a 2"x2" screen. That is why they are hesitant to bundle it into the phones.

    I like the debate though so thanks for your response.

    Compo
    700P...755...Pre+...Pre 2...Touchpad
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by compo View Post
    Theog,

    I am a business person and I understand the profit motive of any organization. I think they could be profitable if they lowered the prices and made it more appealing to a wider audience. I can tell you now the average person will not pay close to $100 a month for a cell phone no matter how many bells and whistles it has.
    I also run a business... I was not doing so hot while running with my competitors... once I upgraded and increased my prices way above the others, I started doing well. Finding a way to increase your net income is one of the best ways to grow a business. (of course, not that simple, but this is not a business class. lol) Of course, there are many tricks and "yea, but."

    I don't think sprint has to worry about what the "average" person will pay for a phone. What sprint is looking for is "x" amount of people willing to pay $100 for a phone. If it works like it does for me, the "x" people will help pay for those paying lesser... and you want the people paying lesser to eventually pay $100.

    As you can tell, I don't believe in "going cheap." Works for wal-mart, but few other businesses.

    My main complaint has to do with the stratified pricing. Obviously, VZN thinks they can make money charging $29.99 for unlimited data (Centro) where if you purchased a 755 instead of a Centro you would have to pay at least $39.99.
    Two different products aimed at two different customers. Maybe in testing the avg centro user uses less data or minutes or something else... I don't know, I'm pissing in the wind... but you never know.

    What if you walked into a store and they charged you $2 for a half gallon of milk but the next guy in line got it for $1.50 because he had black hair. Wouldn't you be angry?
    Analogies seldom fit... I could come up with two that make my point. Plus, I'm on sero and someone with a plan with less features than mine pays more (they are not on sero). So I should be mad at myself.

    I think that once Wifi becomes more common many people will think twice about paying $480 for internet on a 2"x2" screen. That is why they are hesitant to bundle it into the phones.

    I like the debate though so thanks for your response.

    Compo
    I don't see how wifi fits right now... wifi is not free. Someone pays for the wifi you use. They might give it away for you to shop at their establishment or to stay at their hotel, but let them catch you using it without permission (or without using their service).

    Everything costs something...

    I like a good healthy debate as well... many times the debates always end up with one person calling the other person an ***** because they don't agree...

    People can agree to disagree... having a different opinion is just that... a different opinion... no one is any better than anyone else...

    Although, it is fun to call someone an ***** every now and again to see their reaction.
    Last edited by theog; 06/24/2008 at 07:52 PM.
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  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by compo View Post
    Theog,

    I am a business person and I understand the profit motive of any organization. I think they could be profitable if they lowered the prices and made it more appealing to a wider audience. 1. I can tell you now the average person will not pay close to $100 a month for a cell phone no matter how many bells and whistles it has.

    2. My main complaint has to do with the stratified pricing. Obviously, VZN thinks they can make money charging $29.99 for unlimited data (Centro) where if you purchased a 755 instead of a Centro you would have to pay at least $39.99. What if you walked into a store and they charged you $2 for a half gallon of milk but the next guy in line got it for $1.50 because he had black hair. Wouldn't you be angry?

    3. I think that once Wifi becomes more common many people will think twice about paying $480 for internet on a 2"x2" screen. That is why they are hesitant to bundle it into the phones.

    I like the debate though so thanks for your response.

    Compo
    1. But then you have quite a few iPhone lovers jumping up and down to pay more. Although with the newer sucky economy, I'm still wondering if that number will be more limited this time around. We'll see after July 11.

    2. I agree! Unlimited data is unlimited data no matter what phone you use(however it's really capped at 5GB, I keep hearing)! Carriers get away with this due to their "assumptions" that business smartphone users use more data. That seems to be the excuse they use. The Centro is more of a personal type smartphone(look at the way they advertise it).

    Although I wonder if you can take them to task on this one due to the OS being almost exactly the same as Treo's. Business can probably be done on the Centro just fine!

    3. I LOVE wifi, but seriously there's not enough of it. And the carriers bank on this. Cities can never seem to get their citywide wifi programs launched. I wonder why? Things that make you go hmmm...

    It's also interesting how carrier backed wifi is often found with strings attached so that they're getting paid somehow. T-Mobile and AT&T have figured out how to make money. You must be a customer of either to use their wifi and/or buy a pre-paid card in T-Mobile's case.

    Those were just some of my thoughts in response to your post. Yes the carriers are getting away with overcharging for the most part, IMO too.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  7. #7  
    < < Edit by Septimus -- what theog says below. > >

    Could the mods ban this spammer? What the heck.....
    Last edited by Dieter Bohn; 06/25/2008 at 12:10 PM.
    .....Life is But Such Sweet Sorrow.....
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by Merovingian View Post
    Could the mods ban this spammer? What the heck.....
    Next time you quote a spammer, make sure the url is not in the reply.

    Normally just hitting the "report" button is sufficient... no need to reply.

    I've reported your post so the mods can remove the spammers link.
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  9. CPL Radar's Avatar
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    #9  
    The point of business is to make your shareholders happy. You do this by making money. When I first entered the business world I discovered the golden rule of service pricing. Come up with the highest price you think someone is willing to pay for whatever service you provide and then charge 50% more than that number.

    As far as nickle and dime, landline service is even worse than cell phone service. Landline services aren't building new infrastructure to support their users, they are using public systems, that are going to continue to operate whether the phone company goes out of business tomorrow or not, and the telephone lines have already been paid for by either Ma Bell back in the day or the local municipalities, plus any new last mile wiring is now done by the community devolopers. What people seem to forget is that the government already pays for your actual hardline phone service, but it took the phone companies nickle and diming to make you pay them for the same service.
  10. #10  
    For the last year or so, I was using a T-Mobile Sidekick with an unlimited plan. In a concession to gas prices, I dropped it as my contract ran out and dusted off my old Treo 650 and Enfora sled. To really save a few $$, I popped in a T-Mobile 1000 minute pre-paid sim. Lasts 1yr and can be refilled. In the last week, I've found reasonably good wifi coverage in NYC at least. It occasionally means walking a block or two to a park or library, but the savings amount to a good $700/year over what I was paying. To be sure, I have to be careful not to waste time on the phone, but something had to give.
  11. #11  
    That's why its a shame that Sprint is going down the tubes... Once/If Sprint is gone, its really going to be a cartel of AT&T and Verizon... no "commodity" marketplace at all. So we all have GOOD reason to root for Sprint, even through its boneheaded moves, because Sprint is what keeps the wireless market even somewhat competitive... (e.g. it is widely believed that the recent introduction of reasonable unlimited plans was largely due to Sprint's instigation, even if it was scooped in the national release by a few weeks by Verizon). And certainly, the current data pricing is largely kept at bay by Sprint...
  12. #12  
    Bless SERO.
    That's all I have to say.
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by patchs View Post
    Bless SERO.
    That's all I have to say.
    Here, here!
    Grant Smith
    A+, Net+, MCPx2, BSIT/VC, MIS

    eNVENT Technologies
    Use your imagination.
    --
    Sprint HTC Evo 4G

    DISCLAIMER: The views, conclusions, findings and opinions of this author are those of this author and do not necessarily reflect the views of eNVENT Technologies.
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by patchs View Post
    Bless SERO.
    That's all I have to say.
    SERO is not the only game in town when it comes to cheap data and believe it or not there are prepaid options where you don't sign over your firstborn child in a 2-year contract. Besides I still think there are ethical issues with the SERO plan even though it is widely available via workarounds posted on this forum and many others. Remember just because Sprint looks the other way and you can enter an email address for a person you don't even know doesn't make it right or ethical. But that's a topic for another forum.

    What people may not realize it that you can get unlimited data on AT&T GoPhone PAYG for only $20 a month with no extra commitment to a voice plan. If you don't make a lot of voice calls (which I don't) this can actually come out quite a bit cheaper than even SERO and you aren't selling your soul to Sprint with a 2-year contract either. Keep in mind that prepaid already includes taxes and by refilling with cards purchased from cheapphonecards.com you can get a discount of up to 10%. A SERO plan can cost up to $35 per month with taxes and fees added on where most PAYG prepaid plans have no taxes or fees added on. Most people used to think prepaid was only for those with bad credit but nowadays it is often cheaper than postpaid if you do your homework.
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by haasfamily View Post
    SERO is not the only game in town when it comes to cheap data and believe it or not there are prepaid options where you don't sign over your firstborn child in a 2-year contract. Besides I still think there are ethical issues with the SERO plan even though it is widely available via workarounds posted on this forum and many others. Remember just because Sprint looks the other way and you can enter an email address for a person you don't even know doesn't make it right or ethical. But that's a topic for another forum.

    What people may not realize it that you can get unlimited data on AT&T GoPhone PAYG for only $20 a month with no extra commitment to a voice plan. If you don't make a lot of voice calls (which I don't) this can actually come out quite a bit cheaper than even SERO and you aren't selling your soul to Sprint with a 2-year contract either. Keep in mind that prepaid already includes taxes and by refilling with cards purchased from cheapphonecards.com you can get a discount of up to 10%. A SERO plan can cost up to $35 per month with taxes and fees added on where most PAYG prepaid plans have no taxes or fees added on. Most people used to think prepaid was only for those with bad credit but nowadays it is often cheaper than postpaid if you do your homework.
    1. I got my SERO plans through Sprint customer service by asking for them (it was a little more complicated but it was all legitimate).

    2. I pay $30.00 per line for 500 anytime minutes and unlimited everything else. This is far better than $20.00 a month just for data.

    Anyhow, preaching to the masses on the virtues of SERO is not the point of this thread nor is arguing whose got the cheaper or better deal carrier or customer. The point is that we get reamed either way (just some less than others...).
    Grant Smith
    A+, Net+, MCPx2, BSIT/VC, MIS

    eNVENT Technologies
    Use your imagination.
    --
    Sprint HTC Evo 4G

    DISCLAIMER: The views, conclusions, findings and opinions of this author are those of this author and do not necessarily reflect the views of eNVENT Technologies.
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by haasfamily View Post
    SERO is not the only game in town when it comes to cheap data and believe it or not there are prepaid options where you don't sign over your firstborn child in a 2-year contract. Besides I still think there are ethical issues with the SERO plan even though it is widely available via workarounds posted on this forum and many others. Remember just because Sprint looks the other way and you can enter an email address for a person you don't even know doesn't make it right or ethical. But that's a topic for another forum.

    What people may not realize it that you can get unlimited data on AT&T GoPhone PAYG for only $20 a month with no extra commitment to a voice plan. If you don't make a lot of voice calls (which I don't) this can actually come out quite a bit cheaper than even SERO and you aren't selling your soul to Sprint with a 2-year contract either. Keep in mind that prepaid already includes taxes and by refilling with cards purchased from cheapphonecards.com you can get a discount of up to 10%. A SERO plan can cost up to $35 per month with taxes and fees added on where most PAYG prepaid plans have no taxes or fees added on. Most people used to think prepaid was only for those with bad credit but nowadays it is often cheaper than postpaid if you do your homework.
    That prepaid stuff doesn't include unlimited text though...and is that unlimited data for all phones? Does it include 3G also?
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by gksmithlcw View Post
    1. I got my SERO plans through Sprint customer service by asking for them (it was a little more complicated but it was all legitimate).

    2. I pay $30.00 per line for 500 anytime minutes and unlimited everything else. This is far better than $20.00 a month just for data.

    Anyhow, preaching to the masses on the virtues of SERO is not the point of this thread nor is arguing whose got the cheaper or better deal carrier or customer. The point is that we get reamed either way (just some less than others...).
    I'm not arguing who got the better deal, I just wish the postpaid model of wireless service with contracts would go by the wayside so we wouldn't feel like the carriers are sucking us dry by locking us into a relationship with them. North America seems to be that last outpost hanging on to locked phones and CDMA technology while the rest of the world uses unlocked phones and GSM as a standard. Also prepaid seems to be the standard way of obtaining wireless around the world rather than postpaid accounts. You don't like your carrier, simply swap out your SIM card and move on to the next one. You can't do that with CDMA, 2-year contracts, and phones locked to a particular carrier. What we need are more legitimate options for unlocked phones at a reasonable price and a prepaid GSM market that offers data, text, and voice service at reasonable prices. Let competition drive the marketplace and hopefully drive down prices.

    It's already happening somewhat slowly in the US prepaid market. Just a couple of years ago the major US carriers were basically ignoring the prepaid market. Now all of them except Sprint (I'm not counting Boost Mobile) offer prepaid phones and plans at somewhat competitive prices. GSM has the advantage technology wise (not coverage wise) because if you don't like your carrier you simply swap out your SIM card and move on. CDMA makes things more difficult because you're basically stuck with your carrier. PagePlus is the only CDMA service provider (operating as a Verizon MVNO) that has opened up the CDMA marketplace by allowing you to activate any Verizon phone with its service although they aren't offering data yet. To my knowledge, AT&T is the only provider offering prepaid data and text packages that can be used with any GSM phone.
  18. #18  
    The problem is that CDMA is better than GSM... ;-)
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by Trevante View Post
    That prepaid stuff doesn't include unlimited text though...and is that unlimited data for all phones? Does it include 3G also?
    Prepaid data on AT&T includes 3G and it works on any GSM phone that supports 3G including smartphones. SERO beats prepaid hands down for price when it comes to combining all 3 (voice, data, text) but it's good to know there's a choice for those who don't want to sign contracts or have ethical problems with how you sign-up for SERO. Both unlimited data and text are available on AT&T GoPhone for $20 per month but you have to pay a la carte. In other words, $20 for unlimited data and another $20 for unlimited text. Smaller packages of data and text are available for lower costs as well.
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by gksmithlcw View Post
    The problem is that CDMA is better than GSM... ;-)
    In the US that you have no choice but to get a locked down carrier riddled and disabled phone. This happens in GSM too, but at least I can opt out and get a fully functioning phone. Plus it works overseas.

    You also cannot switch phones when you want to without renewing a contract. Not so on GSM.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
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