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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by JGold View Post
    ... especially one that syncs with the most popular music store on the planet, ...
    Also the "most proprietary" music store on the planet. Apple and the ipod have created an "island of success" for themselves here., I'd rather have a media player that handles as many possible licensed and free formats as possible. I don;t see this in the iPod/iPhone. A playyer such as the Archos models seems to make the most sense to me, instead of an ipod Granted, you are right about popular! but I don't think we want the Treo to be more like Apple in it's proprietary-ness., I think many of us (me included) are frustrated that Palm is not as agile with the treo/palm as we'd like.

    For myself, I'm willing to wait for Palm's Linux OS, as waiting will assuredly mean a better OS from the get-go, and not having, in the future, to deal with backwards compatability issues because they rushed out a half-baked solution. Writing a new o/s has proven to be a very difficult task (for Palm, PalmSource, and Access), so I'd say the task is not trivial.

    Thinking the worst I possibly can about Apple: Initially I thought they chose Cingular because Apple could tell Cingular how the game would be played, but now I'm wondering if the Apple smartphone O/S might not yet be capable of handling the harder requirements such as EVDO Rev A. (It's probably closer to that than the Palm/Linux OS's are) but Apple chose a very easy target while Palm is currently going for a very hard target. Sprint/Verizon are probably "ahead" of what Apple could deviver on anyway. Apple went for glitz, at the expense to the customer of being very proprietary. I'd rather wait to have the harder target Palm is going for (as long as they don't get killed in the short run).

    Having worked in the past for a Japanese company (Hitachi), I really appreciate the long-run approach Palm is taking with the future of their current core product.

    PS: (Don't get me stated on the Foleo though, I can't defend Palm on that one.)

    --
    Bob
    I'm both super! ... and a doer!
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by Chatter View Post
    What device is defective?

    Marc
    Hi Marc,
    Good to hear from you on the forums here! I think the poster is meaning that the 700p (and presumably 755 by his inference) hardware is "defective" because it was adapted for use with both "Palm" and "Windows" mobile OS'es. The poster may mean that the lag produced by this hardware compromise is the "defective" part of the current models. Personally, I was disappointed by this too, but I felt really good that Steve Sinclair was honest enough to divulge that this was the reason for the lag. Personally, I puked a little in the early days of the Windows Mobile Treo announcements, but now I see it was necessary to support EVDO Rev A on Sprint and Verizon, and since developing a new OS to compete with Micro$oft is a really hard project, that Palm had no choice and they made the best compromises they could given these constraints. I'm glad you are at Palm, and I don't know why people can't read between the lines and figure these things out the way I do. Perhaps ArmChair QuarterBacking is easy. Maybe I'm not reading 100% correctly between the lines, but I suspect I'm not that far off from reality!

    regards,
    --
    Bob
    I'm both super! ... and a doer!
  3.    #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclancy View Post
    Hi Marc,
    Good to hear from you on the forums here! I think the poster is meaning that the 700p (and presumably 755 by his inference) hardware is "defective" because it was adapted for use with both "Palm" and "Windows" mobile OS'es. The poster may mean that the lag produced by this hardware compromise is the "defective" part of the current models. Personally, I was disappointed by this too, but I felt really good that Steve Sinclair was honest enough to divulge that this was the reason for the lag. Personally, I puked a little in the early days of the Windows Mobile Treo announcements, but now I see it was necessary to support EVDO Rev A on Sprint and Verizon, and since developing a new OS to compete with Micro$oft is a really hard project, that Palm had no choice and they made the best compromises they could given these constraints. I'm glad you are at Palm, and I don't know why people can't read between the lines and figure these things out the way I do. Perhaps ArmChair QuarterBacking is easy. Maybe I'm not reading 100% correctly between the lines, but I suspect I'm not that far off from reality!

    regards,
    --
    Bob

    Thanks Bob for rephasing the "defective phone" and that is what I intended to convey.
  4.    #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by Chatter View Post
    What device is defective?

    Marc

    Both the 700p and the 755p because of the lag. Steve had said in Dec of 06 that the lag on the 700p was inherent to the hardware design of the device which was made to work on the Win OS and the Palm OS, so I think that is defective when you hit an icon or doing text editing in contacts or even in answering a phone call that the phone does not respond immediately. It is annoying. That is why I am going to try the BB 8830 next week. I have been a Palm OS user since the Palm Professional. My wife uses the 650 Treo and does not have near the trouble that I have, of course she does not have EVDO. Thanks for paying attention to our forums Marc.

    We really want Palm to successful but enough is enough! They are the technology company that should be in front ahead of Apple. They have had success but they always short changed us with either the screen or the memory from the Palm Prof thru the Treo 755p with the lag and BT issues. When I got the 755 I could not connect to my Camry which had connected quickly with the 700p and I predicted that it would not connect with the 700p post MR which was basically true. I finally got it to connect with the help of another Treo Central user but it was a pain. That why all the frustations with the comments on this forum. We want and expect more from Palm. What happened to the company, they in turn give the us the Foleo. We want the Palm Linux Treo! All that development could have been focused on making the best smartphone on the market with Palm wooing us instead of Apple and RIM.

    BY THE WAY TC READERS WHAT IS ACCESS DOING BEHIND THE SCENES???
  5. #25  
    I don't understand why Palm won't upgrade its WM treos to be as feature rich as HTC's products: wifi, GPS, 320x320 screen, thinner (17-19mm) form factor, BT 2.0, better battery life. I know that the Garnet OS has its limitations, but WM is more than capable of supporting all of the above hardware without a hiccup (given enough RAM and ROM).

    Price it the same as flagship HTC models on all of the carriers (i.e. Sprint mogul, AT&T 8525, etc.) and the units would fly off the shelves.

    Do the above, and continue working on POS II. It would keep investors happy, WM Treo users delighted, and show loyal POS users that Palm is willing to innovate and lead the pack again.
  6. #26  
    I will keep my 700p until PalmOSII comes out. I keep my devices for over a year to two years anyways. I am not a gadgaholic needing to get everything new device in the sun being that my 700 does all I need for now. I also like to take advantage of all discounts comming to me at the end of two years with a device. I only break my normal device trend if their is something inovative I can't pass up, then and only then I will do as the gadget feen. If Palm doesn't get it right after my wait, I will definitely be done with them.
    at&t iPhone3G
  7. #27  
    Can't see why anyone would be surprised by this info... not that anyone is from the sound of the peeps on this forum... but on some other forums they sound surprised. lol... whatever...

    I've said for years they needed new management, even before saying so was so popular. Some very bad steps put palm here... wow... who would have guessed all of this in '98 or '99 or even '00.

    I still remember when I first saw the m500... what a feeling... what a feeling....
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  8. #28  
    Fact is, we don't know why the delay...

    It could be all sorts of things: hardware not ready/available in quantity, carrier approval, re-vamp of some features after iPhone release, newer technology is available to adapt to the OS, need to get the SDK to 3rd parties/wait for them to be ready, etc.

    It could be a huge setback or maybe they just want to get it right and will feel better with a solid launch in 2008. Would it be better if they rush it to market? Even the iPhone has it quirks (Safari crashes) and they had all the time in the world.

    We'll just have to wait and see but they have WM (50% of Treos) to keep them going for awhile and I expect to see new 320x320 WM devices this year, hopefully.

    WMExperts: News, Reviews & Podcasts + Twitter
  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    Fact is, we don't know why the delay...

    .
    We all kinda know palm is done.... I hope they can pull a rabbit out the hat, but face it, they won't. Everyone is sad and don't want to admit this fact.... us whores of palm will continue to hold out hope.

    I'll wait... I'm so dumb....

    We all know they will release a product that is not "really" ready, but we will say the next version of linux treo will be "IT." You know, we will give them a pass on the first device..... Yea, whatever... my goodness....
    Last edited by theog; 07/04/2007 at 05:22 AM.
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  10. #30  
    Those of you complaining about how long it is taking to modernize PalmOS have no idea how many steps are involved. First, they must modify linux to run on Treo hardware, and write a compatibility layer to support legacy applications Then they must spin off a separate company to market the new operating system. Next, they will need to rename their company to something like Treoworks. After that, they should pay an enormous sum of money to license the new OS from the company they just spun off. A clever next move would be to announce several versions of the new OS which will never appear in any device, thus baffling the competition. After that, Treoworks will be acquired by a larger firm, perhaps NCR or PepsiCo.
    A few years later, if all goes well, Treoworks will be relaunched as a separate company, and renamed Palm. In the mean time, Access will acquire the company owning the Palm linux OS, and will announce that in the future it will run as a virtual OS on windows-based cell phones, using a custom version of VMWare which will be available in Q3 2064.
    Last edited by Naam Gozar; 07/05/2007 at 12:09 AM.
  11. #31  
    The only name changes necessary at this point for palm would be to either birdflip, backhand or backfire.

    The logo should be changed to a hazard sign similar to something like: Warning - falling rocks.....

    Appropriate for both the value of the "company's" stock AND products.
  12. ediamond's Avatar
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    #32  
    Naam, I think you're kind of missing the point. Garnet has been around in one form or another since 2001. Whole operating systems have come and gone in that time. With every ticking second, they are moving themselves closer and closer to total irrelevance. Anyone remember Kaypro?

    I find it scandalous that Palm was screwing around with the Foleo when it shoudl have been throwing all its resources into diggin themselves out of the hole they've neglected themselves into. The Foleo is a perfect example of how Palm's eye has come off the ball again and again.

    Say what you want about the iPhone, Apple has built an entire phone platform in the space of 3 or 4 years. and for those who like to point out that there are hundreds of applications for Palm OS, and the Treo is a more capable device than iPhone, I would point out that this is exactly the same arguement that the Newton fanboys made, when USR announced the first Pilot 1000. But when the first Pilot came out it was a stripped down simplified interface with a limted feature set. And people lined up for it.

    But this isn't about the iPhone. Palm is in a dangerous place. PDAs are dead. the smartphone market is continually coming out with new models from new players: Samsung, LG, re ng phones that look great, feel great, and are reliable. Palm is still using the same essential form factor: thick, heavy with weak battery life, no wifi, no multitasking, crap browser...the list goes on and on. And what do they do? their "revolutionary product" is a solution without a problem!!

    I've liked Palm since their days at USR, but they need to get rid of colligan and get a new Steve Jobs-like CEO who will clean house, keep Palm focused, and make products that people want. here is not much time.
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by Naam Gozar View Post
    Those of you complaining about how long it is taking to modernize PalmOS have no idea how many steps are involved. First, they must modify linux to run on Treo hardware, and write a compatibility layer to support legacy applications Then they must spin off a separate company to market the new operating system. Next, they will need to rename their company to something like Treoworks. After that, they should pay an enormous sum of money to license the new OS from the company they just spun off. A clever next move would be to announce several versions of the new OS which will never appear in any device, thus baffling the competition. After that, Treoworks will be acquired by a larger firm, perhaps NCR or PepsiCo.
    A few years later, if all goes well, Treoworks will be relaunched as a separate company, and renamed Palm. In the mean time, Access will acquire the company owning the Palm linux OS, and will announce that in the future it will run as a virtual OS on windows-based cell phones, using a custom version of VMWare which will be available in Q3 2064.
    No-one appreciates your satire. You deserve a +1 Funny

    Surur
  14. #34  
    I'm was hoping that their next great phone will sort of "need" the Foleo, for whatever reason. I thought they'd say, here's the Foleo, and about a month later say, you know what, here's a new phone that will work great with that Foleo thing. Kind of like a let down, then a Bang!

    It doesn't look like that's going to happen, though, with this delay announced. I think it's bad for Palm, us, and software developers. For instance, I'm really liking RingCare, but for $30, I'd hate to buy it and then, for some reason, it not work (or maybe not be needed) in the next Palm device. Sure, that's always a risk we take, but it being on the horizon, it's making me think twice before clicking the buy now button.

    Another thing is Apple (yeah, I know everyone's tired of hearing about it). I'm a 1/2 fan of the iPhone. I like the idea and the interface, but I don't like that it's only on Cingular for the next 5 years and that there's no cache to hold the web 2.0 applications. I am hoping they'll come out with a different device, for using on networks like Sprint (that would probably loop around the 5 year thing), but even then, I don't know if I'd jump ship.

    I love my Palm Treo 700p, but I want more. I borrowed someone's m505 (I think???) back in 2004 (it was old and outdated then) and loved it. When I first bought my 650 back in 2005, I thought, wow, great, similar interface, less learning. Now with my 700p, I'm looking at it, thanking, hey, this is the same stuff as 4 years ago. It's a bit updated, but give me something new!

    I'm not sure why I'm bothered, I can't upgrade until next March anyway. I think I just need something new to be excited about.
  15. tirk's Avatar
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    #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    Fact is, we don't know why the delay...
    Leopard was delayed by the iPhone, perhaps this delay is due to the Foleo?
    PalmPilot Professional...Palm Vx...Treo 600...Treo 680...HTC Touch HD...iPhone 4S...
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by Naam Gozar View Post
    Those of you complaining about how long it is taking to modernize PalmOS have no idea how many steps are involved. First, they must modify linux to run on Treo hardware, and write a compatibility layer to support legacy applications Then they must spin off a separate company to market the new operating system. Next, they will need to rename their company to something like Treoworks. After that, they should pay an enormous sum of money to license the new OS from the company they just spun off. A clever next move would be to announce several versions of the new OS which will never appear in any device, thus baffling the competition. After that, Treoworks will be acquired by a larger firm, perhaps NCR or PepsiCo.
    A few years later, if all goes well, Treoworks will be relaunched as a separate company, and renamed Palm. In the mean time, Access will acquire the company owning the Palm linux OS, and will announce that in the future it will run as a virtual OS on windows-based cell phones, using a custom version of VMWare which will be available in Q3 2064.
    I got it, and it was dang funny. Kudos for making me laugh.
    Visor Edge + VisorPhone -> Samsung i300 -> Treo 300 -> Treo 600 -> Treo 700p -> Treo 755
  17. ediamond's Avatar
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    #37  
    Sorry, it was late and I was tired. I was sardonically impaired.

    But it makes me mad to see a great platform like Palm go down the tubes like this. Not with a bang, but with a "huh?" It makes me a little emotional.
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by ediamond View Post
    Sorry, it was late and I was tired. I was sardonically impaired.

    But it makes me mad to see a great platform like Palm go down the tubes like this. Not with a bang, but with a "huh?" It makes me a little emotional.
    Its not over until the fat Treo sings.
    at&t iPhone3G
  19. #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by KStewart View Post
    Its not over until the fat Treo sings.
    Sooner, rather than later. She's clearing her throat...
    I find it sad/odd that people ask to be thanked. How genuine is it when you have to ask? It's like forcing your kid to call Grandma, to thank her for the new underwear she sent for their birthday.

    "To me, clowns aren't funny. In fact, they're kind of scary. I've wondered where this started and I think it goes back to the time I went to the circus, and a clown killed my dad.
    -Jack Handy, SNL-


  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by ScaryHumor View Post
    Sooner, rather than later. She's clearing her throat...
    Your century twenty one too Scary? Good to see ya again...feeling a bit of Nastalsia.
    at&t iPhone3G
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