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  1.    #1  
    The story is here.

    For some reason my conclusion - that the PalmOS as a host OS will be dead within a year - seems both huge and not-at-all important at the same time (since we'll have GHost).
  2. #2  
    Important for a few apps here and there, but I think that a lot of the missing functionality some apps bring won't be missed at all.

    - going to read article now -

    Interesting, I missed that release but that would be a nice achievement for Access in the light of the Cobalt debacle. If things are ship shape, then your reasoning for seeing devices by this time next year could hold true, though I doubt that carrier testing would be done lest they really dotted 'i's and crossed 't's in relations to how well ALP will play with carrier's existing setups for other mobie OSes.
    MMM | AntoineRJWright.com | BH | Jaiku

    Moved on to Symbian, but still will visit from time to time.
  3. #3  
    It's nice that they are going to release a framework, but I'd prefer they finish the d**m OS first. How about something showing how it look? What I've seen so far is not very interesting at all.

    Personally, I don't think any devices with this OS would be possible on any U.S. carrier until at least early 2008. I still very much doubt Palm will be using ALP, I just don't see any evidence that they are interested or working on it.
    Main Phone: Treo 270/600/650/700w/700p/750v/Motorola Q/iPhone
    Tried but sold: Motorola Q/Nokia E61/700wx/HTC TyTN/Treo 680
  4.    #4  
    Whether Palm uses it or not is an interesting question and still up for grabs.

    Apparently Access is going to show some more in Amsterdam in a week or so at a conference.
  5. #5  
    Is the Modzilla license closer to GNU license or BSD license?
  6. TazUk's Avatar
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    #6  
    At then end of the day PalmOS is just a name, I think everyone excepted that it would cease to exist after Access bought Palm Source. What they call it isn't that important, what it's like is.

    There are three possible reasons why Palm aren't being mentioned in connection with ALP, they may have looked at it and decided it wasn't going to be good enough, they may be working on their own OS or they may like it but aren't prepared to pay the price Access want for licensing it.
  7. #7  
    There are three possible reasons why Palm aren't being mentioned in connection with ALP, they may have looked at it and decided it wasn't going to be good enough, they may be working on their own OS or they may like it but aren't prepared to pay the price Access want for licensing it.
    Or it just may not be polished enough to make a decision on yet. Remember Colligan said just a week or two ago that Treos would not abandon Palm functionality (or smething like that). You could take that to mean they are looking at ALP which includes Palm emulation.

    I'm guessing that PalmSource, in its aborted development of Cobalt, found that they were going to have to do the same as Access....basically scrap the existing OS and run OldPalm apps in emulation. Personally I'd rather wait a couple of years more and get a solid, properly designed and properly coded OS rather than additional kludging of the Palm OS which really wasn't ideally adapted to multitasking and all this telephony and network functionality. I'm looking forward to the Treo 800a (a for ALP) in 2008!
  8. #8  
    I think its too late for ALP. In another year, M$ and Symbian will be too strong.
  9. #9  
    Apple successfully migrated the underpinnings of its operating system while leaving the user interface the same/improved. Why can't Palm achieve the same result? Let's hope it can, anyway. So on that basis I'd say that PalmOS is dead just the same way that OS9 is dead for Apple.

    Well, not dead. Just sleeping. For a very long time.

    I am now running around with an SDA, Dash, and Treo 650. I like the Treo's UI better than the WM's but after you've had something small and light in your hands . . . . Well, let me just say that the Treo has been in its cradle for the last 4 days straight.

    Palm has a big, big project ahead of it. (1) Completely gut and replace the operating system while keeping the user interface intact. (2) Shrink the hardware -- I think the Dash is the current size target for the market. (3) Do this all at the same time. (4) Do this with less money than any of the competitors, who are all much, much larger than Palm.

    Good luck, Palm. I'm rooting for you. I'll probably support your efforts by buying a 750 when it comes out unlocked/unbranded.
  10. #10  
    ALP's only hope is in being widely adopted, or to b adopted by a huge company with a lot of presence, like Motorola. Otherwise it will be just another OS. They question I really is how much influence And mindshare ALP has with the linux standard bodies. This frame work they are contribution, is it very significant, or is it just another framework, from 10 other open source efforts?

    Access is backed by NTT Docomo, a strong and very influential japanese network, but even DOCOMO has been opening up their networks to windows mobile, recently getting the HTC Z (hermes), and are collaborating with Intel to make dual boot phones, explicitly to allow business to use windows mobile if they want.

    There is a danger of Access making an OS that no-one wants, just like cobalt.

    Surur
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by lyndon_h View Post
    I think its too late for ALP. In another year, M$ and Symbian will be too strong.
    I'm not so sure. It's an expanding market so there's lots of new users without an OS history to tie them down. Plus I'd guess there are substantial proportions of users of both WM and the various Symbian flavours that aren't completely wedded to the OSs on their devices and would be willing to go with something else. Remember that a substantial proportion of smartphone users never add a third party app so they haven't got big software investments constraining them. I also think that as regards personal users (rather than corporate users) many are just much more cavalier in their approach than they are to desktop/laptop OS choice - possibly because they perceive phone OSs as simpler ('it's only a phone') and possibly because the phones are much cheaper (in the UK they're often free with a contract).

    Of course, if Access hope to get anywhere at all they'll have to do a decent job with ALP, and find phone makers to put it on their products, neither of which are a given at this point.
  12. Iceman6's Avatar
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    #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    There is a danger of Access making an OS that no-one wants, just like cobalt.

    Surur
    I have no doubt that every major manufacturer will make the linux OS available on at least some of their devices. I think the danger to Access is, they will take so long getting their linux OS to market that the manufacturers will have already released their own linux phones. Motorola has already done this; Samsung has announced their own reference platform for linux; Palm is reportedly developing their own.

    I was impressed by the article. It almost sounds like Access wants to be the Red Hat of mobile devices. If they release their linux implementation as open source, they have to make their money off of distribution and support, plus whatever they can charge for GHost.
  13. #13  
    I don't know why you guys are worrying. I think ACCESS has the upper hand here.

    Basically they are making the Linux layer for free. And selling the Palm competibility layer for added value. There are tons of handset makers they can sell the software to. Chinese phone makers; Taiwanese; Sharp and other Japanese companies; they can even sell it to Motorola if they are not making close-platform Linux phone already.

    Palm, has no option. Right now it's WM or bust. If they want to retain their former Palm user base, they HAVE TO license ALP. They can't hack multi tasking into Garnet I think due to the deal they have with ACCESS. If they go WM only, they are just another OEM nothing more than a mediocre brand that repackage phones from Taiwan and China. Without any control over the hardware and the software, they have no leverage. There is a reason you don't see Audiovox phone anymore, there is no money in the repackaging business.
  14. DHart's Avatar
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    #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by whatever7 View Post
    I don't know why you guys are worrying. I think ACCESS has the upper hand here.

    Basically they are making the Linux layer for free. And selling the Palm competibility layer for added value. There are tons of handset makers they can sell the software to. Chinese phone makers; Taiwanese; Sharp and other Japanese companies; they can even sell it to Motorola if they are not making close-platform Linux phone already.

    Palm, has no option. Right now it's WM or bust. If they want to retain their former Palm user base, they HAVE TO license ALP. They can't hack multi tasking into Garnet I think due to the deal they have with ACCESS. If they go WM only, they are just another OEM nothing more than a mediocre brand that repackage phones from Taiwan and China. Without any control over the hardware and the software, they have no leverage. There is a reason you don't see Audiovox phone anymore, there is no money in the repackaging business.
    whatever -

    This is the same point I have made in earlier posts. Palm left themselves in a pickle when they lost control of their operating system. WM was as much a HAD TO choice as it was a smart marketing move - although I think it was a smart marketing move also. Without Palm OS and dependent on 3rd party manufacturing, they relegate themselves to being just another hardware designer. I would think it would be very difficult to compete with much larger competitors on hardware design alone. So, yes, I agree, ACCESS has a very strong hand in dealing with Palm.

    Palm has done a very good job (so far) in maintaining their market (and showing signs of possibly growing it) with a 3rd party OS and manufacturing. I guess I am skeptical as to how long they can keep this up. The Palm and Treo names give them a lot of credibility in the market place, but that will diminish if no next gen Palm OS appears (via ACCESS).
  15. #15  
    Realizing NOW that PalmOS is dead is like realizing at 2:30pm that the sun is up.
  16. #16  
    If PalmOS is dead, how did Palm convince Google to port Google Maps to the Treo? Clearly they lifted the skirt and showed them something Google liked.
  17. #17  
    Or paid them.

    Surur
  18. #18  
    Number of existing users? There are a lot of existing Palm OS and Treo users out there. The 680 is likely to sell pretty well if the price is right whether the OS is dead or not.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brandorr View Post
    If PalmOS is dead, how did Palm convince Google to port Google Maps to the Treo? Clearly they lifted the skirt and showed them something Google liked.
    Main Phone: Treo 270/600/650/700w/700p/750v/Motorola Q/iPhone
    Tried but sold: Motorola Q/Nokia E61/700wx/HTC TyTN/Treo 680
  19. #19  
    I Believe in the 900P.




    I have a $25 bet riding on that there will be a Treo released by 02/29/08 with a Palm/Linux OS.

    How many Palm PDAs have been sold? Palm cannot cut cold turkey on the Palm OS -- any new OS for Palm PDAs or Treos will have to have backward compatibility. This OS will either be from Access or Palm itself.

    As I believed in the 700P -- I believe there will be a new Treo in late 2007 or early 2008 that has this beyond Frankengarnet, Palm application backward compatibility, OS.

    The PPR on this conversation will be open July 2007.

    Cheers, Perry.
    Last edited by gtwo; 11/15/2006 at 01:10 PM.
  20. #20  
    I think the odds are good that Palm is working on something based on Linux. However right now Access controls the ability to provide backwards compatibility. I'm 100% convinced that Palm will not use ALP. Can they negotiate to get what they need for compatiblity with Access? Don't know but I'm sure I would count on this.
    Main Phone: Treo 270/600/650/700w/700p/750v/Motorola Q/iPhone
    Tried but sold: Motorola Q/Nokia E61/700wx/HTC TyTN/Treo 680
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