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  1. Haggar's Avatar
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       #1  
    I have to admit that after all of our discussions about the 700P and the lack of a "push" it seems to be getting from Palm, I'm getting a bit squeemish about whether or not Palm is fully committed to the POS after the 700P.

    Assuming that A) there will indeed be a 700P and that B) there are going to be future Treos... what does everyone think about the prospects of having w and p versions of all future Treos? Does this make sense?
  2. cardio's Avatar
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    #2  
    I think (hope) we will see additional POS in the future.
    "If It Weren't For The United States Military"
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  3. #3  
    Palm has already said it will be making future Treos running both Palm OS and Windows Mobile. They don't nedd to decide between the two, "it's and, not or".
    Jimmie Geddes
  4. Haggar's Avatar
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       #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmie Geddes
    Palm has already said it will be making future Treos running both Palm OS and Windows Mobile. They don't nedd to decide between the two, "it's and, not or".
    But I think market realities are going to set in and the POS will ultimately die...

    I just see POS becomming similar to the MacOS...a SBOS (supposedly better operating system) that has a minority percentage of market share...that continually shrinks.

    IMO there needs to be a HUGE release of a new POS that supports all the latest and greatest OS features...PLUS...Palm has to get other hardware vendors to start licensing the new OS -- otherwise it will become just like the Mac...a company who's hardware and software fits in a "niche" which relegates it to limited software and 3rd party hardware options.

    I'd stop buying hardware and software for my POS system and eventually migrate over to the Windows Mobile Platform if I didn't feel like there was a bright future for POS (and I'm starting to feel like the skys are cloudy...).
  5. #5  
    I think the Palm OS has already gone the way of Mac, and it won't die. There are way too many Palm OS users that will keep it alive, and Palm knows it can count on them. Windows Mobile gives Palm a way into the corporate market, which gives them a lot of money and credibility. They don't need to decide between Windows Mobile or Palm OS, they are actually more financially successful by supporting both.
    Jimmie Geddes
  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by Haggar
    But I think market realities are going to set in and the POS will ultimately die...

    I just see POS becomming similar to the MacOS...a SBOS (supposedly better operating system) that has a minority percentage of market share...that continually shrinks.

    IMO there needs to be a HUGE release of a new POS that supports all the latest and greatest OS features...PLUS...Palm has to get other hardware vendors to start licensing the new OS -- otherwise it will become just like the Mac...a company who's hardware and software fits in a "niche" which relegates it to limited software and 3rd party hardware options.

    I'd stop buying hardware and software for my POS system and eventually migrate over to the Windows Mobile Platform if I didn't feel like there was a bright future for POS (and I'm starting to feel like the skys are cloudy...).
    Last edited by dstrauss; 05/08/2006 at 02:20 PM.
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  7. #7  
    Given Palm's sluggish release schedule, I predict that the next wave of Treo models after the 700 will come in about 12 months and will include a model using a Palm home-grown Linux OS with multitasking and Palm OS garnet compatibility. WM may get dropped altogether unless Palm meets resistance from certain carriers (e.g., Verizon).
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  8. #8  
    I agree with Scott about the 12 months, and Palm's own OS running. I don't think Palm will ever give up Windows Mobile, corporations love it.
    Jimmie Geddes
  9. Haggar's Avatar
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       #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmie Geddes
    I think the Palm OS has already gone the way of Mac, and it won't die. There are way too many Palm OS users that will keep it alive, and Palm knows it can count on them. Windows Mobile gives Palm a way into the corporate market, which gives them a lot of money and credibility. They don't need to decide between Windows Mobile or Palm OS, they are actually more financially successful by supporting both.
    As I said above...they can't count on ME. I and suspect there are plenty of others out there who will feel the same.

    The big difference, here, Jimmie, is that Palm USED to license the POS and had many vendors selling devices with the OS. They are still "able" to do that, but no one is taking them up on it. Apple, on the other hand, does not allow others to license their operating system...so you can't see other vendors providing Macs (and we don't need to discuss Apple's dallying around with licensing back in the 90's...I'm talking about currently).

    I consider myself a HUGE Palm/Treo fan. But Palm hasnt' shown me anything lately that proves to me that they are commited to the POS. They may say they will develop both platforms...but if in 2008 they are selling 3/4 a of a million Windows Mobile Devices and 100,000 POS devices a quarter -- will it make sense to keep pouring money into the POS systems?
  10. Haggar's Avatar
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       #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmie Geddes
    I agree with Scott about the 12 months, and Palm's own OS running. I don't think Palm will ever give up Windows Mobile, corporations love it.
    Um...didn't they already give up their OWN operating system? Sure they are creating something new...but changing to Linux OS may impress pinheads like us -- but the average consumer could care less. They see "windows" and think they're getting a "real" windows system on their phone. "Linux? What's that?" would be the response from most consumers...
  11. #11  
    Palm used to license their OS, but Palm isn't Palm anymore.
    Jimmie Geddes
  12. Haggar's Avatar
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       #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmie Geddes
    Palm used to license their OS, but Palm isn't Palm anymore.
    Agreed...they are now a Windows Licensee...
  13. #13  
    Palm is a Palm OS licensee (Garnet) and Windows Mobile licensee, they are a hardware company for now.
    Jimmie Geddes
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott R
    the 700 will come in about 12 months and will include a model using a Palm home-grown Linux OS with multitasking and Palm OS garnet compatibility. WM may get dropped altogether unless Palm meets resistance from certain carriers (e.g., Verizon).
    Add resistance from carriers to price breaks from component manufacturers, now that Qualcomm will embed WM on both CDMA2k and WCDMA chipsets, that's an offer that's gonna be hard to beat and lead to POS or Access or Linux or anything being more expensive than non-WM products. I foresee Symbian holding a strong share of the low-end dialpad style smartphones and WM coming to have a strong precense there and dominate the touch screen share of convergence devices
    La Vie En Diaspora: Enfin, une émission qui raconte votre vie aux Etats-Unis

    Treo 600 in December '03, Treo 650 in February '05, HTC TyTN Pro in August '06, and back to Treo 750 in January '07, find me at MyTreo.net

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  15. Haggar's Avatar
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       #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmie Geddes
    Palm is a Palm OS licensee (Garnet) and Windows Mobile licensee, they are a hardware company for now.
    I understand that...but what I'm saying is, Microsoft has POWER in the mobile field now because they license out the technology. Palm is currently not in that position...and NO ONE, with the exception of Palm, is licensing the POS.

    Flash forward 2 years from now...if the new Linux POS is actually developed and Palm is STILL the only POS company -- what does that do to the POS? And ultimately, why would Palm continue to sell POS based devices if they can compete well in the much larger Windows Mobile market?

    All I'm saying is that I think the handwriting is on the wall...Palm will eventually stop creating devices that use the POS.
  16. #16  
    LG also is a licensee of the Palm OS, not that they've ever made a device, but they are a licensee.

    I know that Microsoft is a power is the mobile field, but if there are still customers for Palm OS devices Palm will still sell them. They might not have the bullet points spec wise that Windows has, but there is still a huge consumer base for Palm OS.
    Jimmie Geddes
  17. Haggar's Avatar
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       #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmie Geddes
    LG also is a licensee of the Palm OS, not that they've ever made a device, but they are a licensee.

    I know that Microsoft is a power is the mobile field, but if there are still customers for Palm OS devices Palm will still sell them. They might not have the bullet points spec wise that Windows has, but there is still a huge consumer base for Palm OS.
    Yes...but the fact that Palm has "engineered the Palm experience" into Windows Mobile 5 as best they can suggests that if they can create enough of a layer over Windows Mobile to satisfy their customers...it shouldn't be too difficult to move current POS customers to Windows Mobile customers when the time comes...

    I love the Treo 700w's form factor (duh, nearly the same as my 650) and I like the phone interface quite a bit too. To be honest...the only reason I returned my 700w was the low resolution screen. If the 700w had a 320x320 screen I'd already be a WM5 convert...and that is coming from someone who has owned a Palm since the original Pilot came out!
  18. #18  
    Honestly, I think what will happenwith Palm will really be decided on Linux whenit debuts. The other key factor will be whether or not our current POS will hold up enough to make the next jump.

    As for the MacOS/POS comparison, I've beena Mac user for the last 11 or 12 years now and live by my Mac, but as someone once pointed out in the Apple/Palm comparision is that Apple has Steve Jobs and Palm does not.
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  19. #19  
    I also liked the 700w's form factor, I preferred it over my 650. Palm has done a nice re-design of the casing, and I'm looking forward to getting the 700p.

    I know they say their giving the Palm experience on Windows Mobile, and yes they've tweaked Windows Mobile a bit to make it more palatable, but it's not the Palm experience by any stretch, it's a great marketing term. You can't have a Palm experience without the Palm OS. I used the 700w and thought it was a great device, as I thought the 6700 I used was great too.
    Jimmie Geddes
  20. Haggar's Avatar
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       #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by mymellowman
    Honestly, I think what will happenwith Palm will really be decided on Linux whenit debuts. The other key factor will be whether or not our current POS will hold up enough to make the next jump.

    As for the MacOS/POS comparison, I've beena Mac user for the last 11 or 12 years now and live by my Mac, but as someone once pointed out in the Apple/Palm comparision is that Apple has Steve Jobs and Palm does not.
    Apple also has iTunes, and Palm does not. I think Jobs is a great marketeer...but that alone is not the reason for Apple's recent successes. The iPod and iTunes, IMO, are what are keeping Apple "in the game" -- and unless Palm has something up their sleeves -- some kind of killer mobile ap...they are going to become roadkill in the mobile market unless they ride the Windows Mobile wave (how many methaphors can I use in one sentence?).

    I remember reading somewhere here on TC that Palm has been hiring some interesting job positions that could indicate the possibility of this kind of killer "mobile ap"...but unless and until it's out there and a major success Palm is going to have a very rough road ahead of them...
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