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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    In the context used tho, a new devcie must have a combination of different features, and a literal interpetaion , to my mind anyway, would indicate that 2 thinsg must change to be a new model, not just changinmg one item to make a new combo. But again, that wording is contradicted apparently in next sentence. In any case, it would appear Ed has a future in politics.
    I don't know where your 2-change rule comes from. "Combination" is a simple word. I don't mean to sound condescending, but there's no ambiguity there, IMO. And I don't see any contradiction in his statements.

    Has someone in the press or elsewhere suggested otherwise ?
    Just clarifying, since the url is someone else's domain.
  2.    #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by samkim
    I don't know where your 2-change rule comes from. "Combination" is a simple word. I don't mean to sound condescending, but there's no ambiguity there, IMO. And I don't see any contradiction in his statements.
    Combination is a simple word but a word's definition is defined by the context. And in this case the context is vague so it leaves room for multiple interpretations. I think we all knew what he meant, it's made clear in the next sentence.

    combination - "two or more people or things that are combined to form a set"

    Let me put it this way. Do these say the same thing ?

    1. "When I say new smartphones, I am referring to a [new] combination of operating systems, hardware designs, radio technologies, or other significant advancements....." If he meant this, I would interpret that Palm considers the 700p and 700w as diffferent models.

    2. "When I say new smartphones, I am referring to a combination of [new] operating systems, hardware designs, radio technologies, or other significant advancements....." If he meant this, I would interpret that Palm considers the 700p and 700w as the same model.

    I was just playing devil's advocate, searching deeply for clues to see if anything could be read between the lines. It was another one of those famous BFNATC's and had nothing better to do

    BFNATC - Boring Friday Night At Treo Central
  3. #23  
    and don't forget the GSM models... 700W (GSM) has to be here soon.

    Would that be a new phone?
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    .Treo Pro on Sprint Check out www.treotricks.com, Audio jack fix.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    Combination is a simple word but a word's definition is defined by the context. And in this case the context is vague so it leaves room for multiple interpretations. I think we all knew what he meant, it's made clear in the next sentence.

    combination - "two or more people or things that are combined to form a set"

    Let me put it this way. Do these say the same thing ?

    1. "When I say new smartphones, I am referring to a [new] combination of operating systems, hardware designs, radio technologies, or other significant advancements....." If he meant this, I would interpret that Palm considers the 700p and 700w as diffferent models.

    2. "When I say new smartphones, I am referring to a combination of [new] operating systems, hardware designs, radio technologies, or other significant advancements....." If he meant this, I would interpret that Palm considers the 700p and 700w as the same model.

    I was just playing devil's advocate, searching deeply for clues to see if anything could be read between the lines. It was another one of those famous BFNATC's and had nothing better to do

    BFNATC - Boring Friday Night At Treo Central
    I now understand what you mean. I think it's much simpler than that.

    If you have baseballs and softballs, and you have wooden bats and aluminum bats, how many bat & ball combinations can you form?

    I think he actually inserted that sentence in the script deliberately to clarify that the 700p, when they release it, is one of the four new models he had talked about.

    Note that his clarifying statements in the past have also created more confusion.

    Quote Originally Posted by nonobeez
    and don't forget the GSM models... 700W (GSM) has to be here soon.

    Would that be a new phone?
    By my interpretation, no. When he says "new radio technologies," I think he's referring to EV-DO and any new integrated radio chip they use in future models. Again, I think he was anticipating that question and trying to clarify.
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by samkim
    By my interpretation, no. When he says "new radio technologies," I think he's referring to EV-DO and any new integrated radio chip they use in future models. Again, I think he was anticipating that question and trying to clarify.
    GSM phone would probably use the next Gen of EDGE... W-CDMA. That is definitely new radio technology.
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    .Treo Pro on Sprint Check out www.treotricks.com, Audio jack fix.
  6. #26  
    Damn. That would be disappointing if all we got were four iterations of the 700. I hope I'm totally misreading this.
  7. #27  
    Here is best case senario:

    1) 700P

    2) Hollywood (GSM)

    3) Lowrider (CDMA)

    with the 700w in GSM form not considered a new release, since it will use EDGE... leaving W-CDMA for the higher end Hollywood.

    What do you think?
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    .Treo Pro on Sprint Check out www.treotricks.com, Audio jack fix.
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by nonobeez
    and don't forget the GSM models... 700W (GSM) has to be here soon.

    Would that be a new phone?

    I don't think so. The 650 crosses platforms without a name change
    Somebody....anybody........................Don't let Dr. Doom spill his Kool-Aid on his brand new "perrywinkle" sweater vest!!!
  9. #29  
    This is whats likely to happen.

    1) 700W EVDO CDMA WM

    2) Hollywood (GSM) UMTS WM

    3) Lowrider GSM GPRS POS

    4) 700P EVDO CDMA POS

    No non-EVDO CDMA Treos. 1 Lowrider GSM non-UMTS Treo. No GSM Treo 700w.

    Surur
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    This is whats likely to happen.

    1) 700W EVDO CDMA WM
    Already released

    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    2) Hollywood (GSM) UMTS WM
    pretty much spelled out everywhere...

    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    3) Lowrider GSM GPRS POS
    No exclusivity for Sprint or Verizon? nothing new here... why not buy a used 650...does not make sense. has to be WM at least!

    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    4) 700P EVDO CDMA POS
    verified!! release date debateable...

    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    No non-EVDO CDMA Treos. 1 Lowrider GSM non-UMTS Treo. No GSM Treo 700w.
    700w in GSM form as been around for over a year... why not release it?
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    .Treo Pro on Sprint Check out www.treotricks.com, Audio jack fix.
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by nonobeez
    700w in GSM form as been around for over a year... why not release it?
    This is news to me. Whats the evidence?

    No exclusivity for Sprint or Verizon? nothing new here... why not buy a used 650...does not make sense. has to be WM at least!
    They will continue to sell the Treo 650 for a long time, in the same way they still sell the Treo 600.

    Surur
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    This is news to me. Whats the evidence?



    They will continue to sell the Treo 650 for a long time, in the same way they still sell the Treo 600.

    Surur
    would you buy a new low end treo (lowrider), when you can get a better phone (650) for the same price used? The phone you describe won't sell!!!

    The lowrider is suppose to be low end... maybe no touch screen... a la Moto Q perhaps?

    As for the 700W in GSM form... look here...

    http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/5...Treo_700_1.jpg

    and

    http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/5...Treo_700_2.jpg

    notice the SIM card slot on the phone... and the date pict was taken.
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    .Treo Pro on Sprint Check out www.treotricks.com, Audio jack fix.
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by nonobeez
    would you buy a new low end treo (lowrider), when you can get a better phone (650) for the same price used? The phone you describe won't sell!!!
    It will be very cheap. Maybe a cool design. Palm is trying to break out from the POS loyal market into the mainstream. I dont think they are trying to sell the lowrider to you.


    As for the 700W in GSM form... look here...

    http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/5...Treo_700_1.jpg

    and

    http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/5...Treo_700_2.jpg

    notice the SIM card slot on the phone... and the date pict was taken.
    Thats no proof. Its obviously a prototype. Who knows if its even functional?

    Surur
  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    It will be very cheap. Maybe a cool design. Palm is trying to break out from the POS loyal market into the mainstream. I dont think they are trying to sell the lowrider to you.
    if they are trying to break out of the POS market, would it not make sense to come out with a WM phone? The 650 will still sell new, I agree, but for less. Very cheap means no touchscreen... POS will not do!

    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    Thats no proof. Its obviously a prototype. Who knows if its even functional?

    Surur
    If I can convert a 650 from CDMA to GSM, I am sure palm can too... The phone exists! Name the last Treo phone that has not made the transition from CDMA to GSM?

    There are other prototypes that exist too that will never see production...

    These are just educated guesses... good for debate.
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    .Treo Pro on Sprint Check out www.treotricks.com, Audio jack fix.
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    This is whats likely to happen.

    1) 700W EVDO CDMA WM

    2) Hollywood (GSM) UMTS WM

    3) Lowrider GSM GPRS POS

    4) 700P EVDO CDMA POS

    No non-EVDO CDMA Treos. 1 Lowrider GSM non-UMTS Treo. No GSM Treo 700w.

    Surur
    So then what about Colligan's "open platform" remark?


    Quote Originally Posted by nonobeez
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    2) Hollywood (GSM) UMTS WM
    pretty much spelled out everywhere...
    What was the source of this info? It's been repeated so often that people accept it as given, but that's never been confirmed by Palm. Was this from the Sagio report? Was this speculation?

    Quote Originally Posted by nonobeez
    would you buy a new low end treo (lowrider), when you can get a better phone (650) for the same price used? The phone you describe won't sell!!!

    The lowrider is suppose to be low end... maybe no touch screen... a la Moto Q perhaps?
    I think a low-end smartphone will eventually be sold for free w/ 2 year data plan. And I'm not so sure it'll be "lower" than the 650. They talked about achieving lower-cost phones by using cheaper integrated radio chips. So they won't necessarily have to take away features.

    As for lowrider being the low-end phone, that's also unconfirmed speculation...

    And couldn't lowrider be the codename for a phone in development to be released in 2007?
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by samkim
    So then what about Colligan's "open platform" remark?



    What was the source of this info? It's been repeated so often that people accept it as given, but that's never been confirmed by Palm. Was this from the Sagio report? Was this speculation?


    I think a low-end smartphone will eventually be sold for free w/ 2 year data plan. And I'm not so sure it'll be "lower" than the 650. They talked about achieving lower-cost phones by using cheaper integrated radio chips. So they won't necessarily have to take away features.

    As for lowrider being the low-end phone, that's also unconfirmed speculation...

    And couldn't lowrider be the codename for a phone in development to be released in 2007?
    good questions! According to the original Sagio report:

    Verizon to come out with 700w in Jan
    Sprint to come out with 700p very soon afterwards (late as march according to report)

    Cingular to come out with Hollywood somewhere around March. To address 3 shortcoming related to poor Palm performance in Europe

    1) antenna
    2) POS not popular
    3) no 3g

    and the Lowrider to be released around the same time using existing radio technology ($300 phone) Source of the info is Morgan Stanley analyst covering HTC... it was mentioned in the Sagio report.

    I guess I was wrong about seeing the 700W outside of Verizon soon...
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    .Treo Pro on Sprint Check out www.treotricks.com, Audio jack fix.
  17. #37  
    There is a chap over at msmobiles.com who keeps on emphasizing the desire for carriers to recoup their investment in 3G, and criticizing OEM's for not serving that need. I think its telling that 3 out of 4 Palm phones will be 3G, with the Lowrider, obviously low-end, not having advanced radios. There is obviously a whole lot more diversity coming to the Palm market. No one single device will ever be as popular as the Treo 650, but hopefully the total sales will continue to increase.

    Surur
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    No one single device will ever be as popular as the Treo 650...
    Give the 700w time. When it's sold eventually by 70+ carriers, I'm sure it's sales will be impressive.
  19. #39  
    That underlines my point really. The Treo 700w will only be sold in North America and Korea. No one else uses EVDO. The Hollywood stands a better chance of going world wide. On the other hand it will be competing against the very much cheaper Lowrider, which, due to the lower price, will have higher volumes. Basically a lot of fragmentation of the market.

    Surur
  20. #40  
    You don't think they'll release a GSM version of 700W?
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