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  1. #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by theBlaze74
    Ah, another level headed fair and balanced TC comparison.
    You also have to consider that it is not that wild a assessemnt wiith what the trade press has said with regard to the700w. I have read about 25 published mag reviews of the Treo700w which call it the "most useable WM5 device ever".....and a huge advantage in internet browsing (if you happen to be in an EVDO area....my region of 3 million folks doesn't qualify yet) but every one of those articles closes with comments ranging from "almost as good as the 650"......to...."a huge step backward"....the latter comment mostly addressing the screen and one handed usage.
  2. #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by Perry Holden
    The speculated and somewhat confirmed 700P (P for PalmOS) is supposed to have these features better than the 650:

    EV-DO (more Internet speed) vs. not
    64mb memory / 52mb useable? vs. 22mb
    1.3 megapixel camera vs. 0.3
    Better Bluetooth
    Fat32 capability for larger than 2GB SD cards for us "iPoders"
    Faster Blazer?
    Other software tweaks?

    Larger memory stacks for greater stability.

    Cheers, Perry
    Not to mention exciting new and undiscovered bugs!

    I think I'll stick with my tried-and-true 650 for a while.
  3. #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by bcaslis
    EVDO = DSL like data speeds. Once you seen it, it's really hard to go back.
    See, I've got a ton of mobile links already set up in SharkLinks, and google.com/gwt/n for those that aren't. I've seen EVDO, but I'm just not sure I'd see the difference over 1xRTT with my particular usage.
  4. #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by gfunkmagic
    I agree that 1xEvDo is huge...but really what the heck is the advantage if you can't stream anything worth while on decrepit FrankenGarnet? Furthermore there's very unlikely to be any support for 3rd party apps like VoIP clients (skype etc) for such an obsolete OS...
    Please explain exactly how "Franken"Garnet is "decrepit." Show your work and use specific examples.
  5. #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by awinsberg
    So, I take it you like WM5 as the option, then?
    He's clearly bought into the FUD over at PIC. Contrary to contrarian belief, Garnet is neither outdated nor obsolete.
  6. #46  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Kirvin
    Contrary to contrarian belief, Garnet is neither outdated nor obsolete.
    So then it's outdated and obsolete.

    Thanks for clearing that up.
    I'm back!
  7. #47  
    I came out of retirement for this?
  8. #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Kirvin
    He's clearly bought into the FUD over at PIC. Contrary to contrarian belief, Garnet is neither outdated nor obsolete.
    PalmSource must have made Cobalt for no reason. Maybe Jeff needs to be reminded of the things Cobalt was supposed to bring to PalmOS.

    PalmSource Introduces Palm OS Cobalt

    The foundation for new categories of smart mobile devices

    SAN JOSE, Calif., PalmSource Developer Conference, Feb. 10, 2004 — PalmSource, Inc. (NASDAQ: PSRC) provider of Palm OS®, a leading operating system powering next generation mobile devices and smartphones, today introduced Palm OS Cobalt, a new enhanced version of the operating system that is designed to enable the creation of new categories of devices for the communications, enterprise, education and entertainment markets. PalmSource also announced Palm OS Garnet, an enhanced version of the popular Palm OS 5, designed to accelerate the development of Palm Powered™ handhelds and smartphones. The two versions of the operating system, Palm OS Cobalt and Palm OS Garnet, offer the Palm Powered platform new functionality without compromising the flexibility, ease-of-use and compatibility that are the hallmarks of Palm Powered mobile devices.

    "Wireless technologies and services have evolved to where enterprises deploying mobile solutions are increasingly relying on connected solutions to take advantage of the benefits that come from real-time access to data," said Kevin Burden, program manager of IDC's Mobile Devices research service. "Palm OS Cobalt's emphasis on managing the security implications of network connectivity, while continuing to provide a scaleable platform that maintains the Palm OS tradition of flexibility and ease of use will help the Palm OS keep pace with the demands of enterprise IT."

    "We believe Palm OS Cobalt will pave the way for new categories of smart mobile devices and solutions, for the communications, enterprise, education and entertainment markets," said David Nagel, president and CEO of PalmSource, Inc. "We have also reinforced our commitment to optimize our platform for wireless devices, by including wireless capabilities in both Palm OS Cobalt and Palm OS Garnet, designed to enable a wide range of smartphones and other wireless products."

    Formerly known as Palm OS 6, Palm OS Cobalt is a complete rewrite of Palm OS designed to maintain ease of use and software compatibility while creating a foundation for next-generation Palm Powered devices and solutions tailored to the growing needs of the communications, enterprise, education and entertainment markets. Palm OS Cobalt improves compatibility with Microsoft Windows, while offering advanced features including:

    Multitasking, multithreading;
    Memory protection;
    Support for more memory and larger screens;
    Industry standards-based security;
    Extensible communication and multimedia frameworks capable of handling multiple connections simultaneously;
    In addition, Palm OS Cobalt provides rich graphics and multimedia features derived from the Be OS, which Palm®, Inc. acquired in 2001.


    Also announced today, Palm OS Garnet builds on the solid foundation of Palm OS 5 and incorporates new built-in technical features such as standard support for a broad range of screen resolutions, dynamic input area, improved network communication, and Bluetooth. Palm OS Garnet is designed to enable licensees to more efficiently bring Palm Powered handhelds and smartphones to market and reduce development costs.

    "Palm OS Cobalt delivers on its promise to bring advanced multimedia and enterprise functionality to the platform, extending its reach to new markets," said Masanobu Yoshida, Senior General Manager, Personal Communication Development Division, IT& Mobile Solutions Network Company for Sony Corporation "PalmSource has maintained its high standards of compatibility, flexibility, data protection and ease-of-use."

    PalmSource Offers New Software Development Tools
    PalmSource also introduced new software development tools for Palm OS Cobalt and Palm OS Garnet. A technical preview of the new Palm OS Developer Suíte is now available to Palm OS developers in the Resource Pavilion in the Developer Zone at www.palmsource.com/developers. The new Palm OS Developer Suite is based on the industry-standard Eclipse environment, an open-source, Integrated Development Environment (IDE) originally developed by IBM that supports software development in a variety of languages, including C, C++, Java and COBOL. The Palm OS Developer Suite provides one set of tools designed to assist Palm OS developers to create and bring to market higher performance wireless, entertainment and enterprise-grade applications that take advantage of the advanced functionality of Palm Powered smart mobile devices. PalmSource and its partners now offer a wide variety of development tools, including Metrowerks CodeWarrior, the Eclipse environment, Borland's tool suite and the Microsoft NET compatible tools from AppForge.

    About Palm OS Cobalt

    Multithreaded, Multitasking — Palm OS Cobalt is designed to enable multiple applications to run simultaneously, so users gain more productivity and a better user experience. For example, a user can listen to MP3 files, book a calendar appointment and take an incoming phone call. A background-processing model is designed to reduce most memory problems commonly associated with multitasking in mobile devices.


    Expanded, Protected Memory Architecture — With support for up to 256MB of RAM and 256MB of ROM, Palm OS Cobalt paves the way for the creation of more sophisticated communications, enterprise, education and entertainment applications. In addition, the new protected memory architecture is designed to protect against applications "hanging" the system or causing crashes.


    System Wide Security Architecture — Palm OS Cobalt provides built-in encryption, authentication and authorization frameworks for securing applications such as enterprise and e-commerce solutions, browsers, wireless email and connections to corporate networks such as VPN. The extensible structure also offers software developers advanced, industry-standard security services and cryptography.


    New Pluggable Communications Design — The modular, flexible, industry-standard STREAMS-based framework is designed to offer a simple way for licensees and software developers to add communications support for a wide variety of networking and communications protocols. Palm OS Cobalt is designed to supports multiple simultaneous communication sessions on various wireless networks, such as downloading WiFi delivered data while receiving a phone call.


    Extensible Multimedia Framework — Palm OS Cobalt is designed to provide a rich graphics and multimedia architecture. Graphics support includes paths, rotation, gradient fills, anti-aliasing, outline fonts and transparency. The new graphics system is designed to support screen sizes up to 32,000 by 32,000 pixels. Multimedia support includes playback of industry-standard audio and video including ADPCM/PCM, MP3, MPEG1 and MPEG4 designed to enable licensees and software developers to more easily build media-based applications. This extensible multimedia framework is designed to enable licensees and software developers to easily add additional audio and video standards.


    Improved PIM Applications & Databases. Palm OS Address Book and Date Book are redesigned to support up to 255 fields, providing better interoperability with Microsoft Outlook. Each standard PIM application is designed to automatically adjust layout size to fit particular actions. For example, a small screen for the Dynamic Input Area when editing a document, and a larger screen when reading an eBook. Palm OS licensees and software developers can also extend and customize underlying schema databases easily to create new fields.


    Better compatibility with Microsoft Outlook and PC files. PalmSource has also added additional fields to Palm OS DateBook and Address Book, designed to correspond more closely to the information stored on Microsoft Outlook. In addition, Palm OS Cobalt is designed to allow users to transfer PC files directly to Palm Powered devices by dragging them onto an icon on the PC desktop, making it even easier for reading and editing.


    Compatibility with existing Palm OS software. Palm OS Cobalt includes a software emulator, designed to enable software programs created for earlier versions of Palm OS to run on Palm OS Cobalt Palm Powered mobile devices.

    About PalmSource
    PalmSource, Inc. is the company behind Palm OS, a leading operating system powering mobile information devices. Approximately 30 million Palm Powered handhelds and smartphones have been sold to date worldwide. Industry leaders Aceeca, AlphaSmart, Fossil, Founder Technology, Garmin, GSL, HuneTec, Kyocera, Lenovo, palmOne, PerComm, Samsung, Sony, Symbol Technologies and Tapwave license Palm OS to create diverse mobile devices that meet unique customer needs. Palm OS has given rise to a large community of users, enterprises, developers and manufacturers, who together make up the Palm Powered Economy. More information about PalmSource is available at http://www.palmsource.com, http://www.palmsource.co.uk, http://www.palmsource.fr, http://www.palmsource.de and http://www.palmsource.com.cn.

    Palm OS is a registered trademark and Palm Powered is a trademark of Palm Trademark Holding Company, LLC. Other brands may be trademarks of their respective owners.


    ----------------------------------------------------------

    Developer Quote Addendum

    "With the release of Palm OS Cobalt, we believe that PalmSource has firmly ushered us into the 'post-pc' age," said Alexis Hinds CEO, Blue Nomad. "The new multitasking, multimedia, and security APIs reaffirm PalmSource's leadership position in the mobile space, and will enable developers to deliver very rich applications to users clamoring for more sophisticated productivity and entertainment applications for Palm Powered handhelds and smartphones."

    "Electric Pocket is excited about the new multimedia support in Palm OS Cobalt, which will enable us to offer advanced video messaging via our Pixer MMS solution for Palm Powered handhelds and smartphones," said Steve Bennett, chief executive officer, Electric Pocket Limited. Wireless carriers demand stability and leading edge capabilities, and we're confident that Palm OS can give us the best of both worlds.

    "Our long-term faith in the Palm OS platform is reinforced by the PalmSource commitment to providing a true modern operating system with multithreaded and multitasking in Palm OS Cobalt," said August Grasis III, CEO of Handmark. "Together with the new extensible multimedia framework Handmark applications will deliver new features and richer user experiences."

    "The powerful processors and rich audio and video capabilities of today's Palm Powered devices make them ideal portable entertainment devices for multimedia," said Brian Hall, president and CEO of Mark/Space, Inc. "The Missing Sync for Palm OS Cobalt from Mark/Space provides a simple and fast means to transfer music, audio and photos between a handheld and iPhoto or iTunes on a Mac."

    "I view Palm OS Cobalt as a watershed event in the growth of the Palm OS platform as it incorporates two technologies that will be vitally important for the enterprise: flexible, schema-based databases and a truly robust security system," said C.E. Steuart Dewar, CEO of Pimlico Software, Inc. "With these technologies in place, developers like Pimlico Software will be able to develop even more powerful applications, which in turn will secure the dominant position of the Palm OS platform in the mobile market."

    "As a leading application developer for the Palm OS platform, we are very excited about OS Cobalt and are committed to leveraging many of its unique capabilities," said John Chaffee, president of SplashData. "The Pluggable Encryption Security Architecture will provide industry-standard security services for our apps that store sensitive information, such as SplashID and SplashMoney. And the extensible multimedia framework will enable us to easily broaden support for additional media formats in our leading image viewer, SplashPhoto."
    http://www.palmsource.com/press/2004/021004_cobalt.html

    Surur
    Last edited by surur; 03/06/2006 at 02:20 PM.
  9. #49  
    Thanks for that stroll down amnesia lane, Surur. No, I didn't need a reminder. I would point out that most of those features have either made it into Garnet as Palm has refined it over time, or found out to have not been necessary after all (multitasking).

    Sharks haven't changed appreciably in 300,000,000 years. Are sharks outdated or obsolete? No, they're perfectly adapted to what they do. As is Palm OS 5. There is no better smartphone OS on the market today.
  10. #50  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tem
    You don't know what it is,,, do you?
    Oh I know, but you won't learn anything if you don't find out for yourself


    I'd be a good parent
  11. #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by vikingjunior
    Merlyn ? How did you get out? I thought Palm put you into the room next to Perry's with a sock in your mouth. J/K. Good to hear from you.
    Been busy with work/classes...TC is too big a distraction sometimes.
  12.    #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Kirvin
    Sharks haven't changed appreciably in 300,000,000 years. Are sharks outdated or obsolete? No, they're perfectly adapted to what they do. As is Palm OS 5. There is no better smartphone OS on the market today.
    I am not POS basher nor WM5 apologist, but what about all the random crashed on POS5? I've only got the 600, but my phone goes into various loops all the time, and for no particular reason. I'd have thought that the 650 would have fixed this, but it seems like the reading I do around here reflects the same old problems of soft and hard resets for weird and unexplainable reasons. On my 600, its seems resets occur mostly related to to many interrelated programs trying to access scant memory at the same time and taking down the whole OS in the fight.....
  13. #53  
    Quote Originally Posted by originalminds
    Having used WM5 on the 6700 I would take anything close to the current version of Palm OS. EVDO is the only thing missing from the Palm Treo to make it VASTLY superior to WM5 devices. I mean think about it...superior number of tested, proven applications...a fraction of the device/OS issues WM5 has...I regret every wasting the money I did on that 6700. I will stick with the 650 until the Treo with Palm OS and evdo capability comes out.
    Now you have to be careful making a claim like that. WM5 has the benefit of being able to run multiple things simultaneously, but the problem that it's inherently microsoft and therefore requires extensive tweaking to get it to perform well. That said, I much prefer the treo/palm interface because of the simplicity and snappiness and friendliness of the UI. In my eyes, WM5's UI doesn't make sense. Why do you need a start menu? The palm way of doing it is much better.

    I'll definitely be one of the first in line to buy the 700p when it comes out, until then I've had to trudge through with this 6700 mainly because I'm hooked on EVDO and the fact that I can stream quality music into my car on the road, or browse the web normally and almost as quick as I could at home on my cable connection. I also like the fact that EVDO allows me to receive calls while in a data session. Palm really hit the mark with the treo interface though, both in hardware and Palm OS software. I can't wait to get my hands on a production version 700p.

    PS - you guys think it's hard waiting for a 700p having never seen one, try having it in your hands for a few days and having to give it up , it's like taking a hit and being addicted but not being able to take another
  14. NRG
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    #54  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tem
    You don't know what it is,,, do you?
    This post this the stick icon .
  15. NRG
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    #55  
    Quote Originally Posted by Merlyn_3D
    PS - you guys think it's hard waiting for a 700p having never seen one, try having it in your hands for a few days and having to give it up , it's like taking a hit and being addicted but not being able to take another
    Who took it from you?
  16. #56  
    Quote Originally Posted by awinsberg
    I am not POS basher nor WM5 apologist, but what about all the random crashed on POS5? I've only got the 600, but my phone goes into various loops all the time, and for no particular reason. I'd have thought that the 650 would have fixed this, but it seems like the reading I do around here reflects the same old problems of soft and hard resets for weird and unexplainable reasons. On my 600, its seems resets occur mostly related to to many interrelated programs trying to access scant memory at the same time and taking down the whole OS in the fight.....
    Two points.

    One, the 650 is significantly more refined than the 600. Mine almost never crashes. Most crashes on Palm OS devices can be traced back to some kind of software conflict. Having used Windows Mobile myself for three years, I can tell you that faulty software can crash it just as quickly. I'm very discerning about what I run on my Treo. And my desktop, for that matter.

    Two, of course you're going to hear about problems on a message board. People using trouble-free Treos aren't going to stop what they're doing and post, "Still doing fine! Just thought you should know!" TC is not representative of the Treo user base.
  17. #57  
    Quote Originally Posted by NRG
    Who took it from you?
    Palm
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    #58  
    I think that's a great point to make. You rarely ever see people post threads saying how good their Treo is running and how happy they are. I post one today just about how important my Treo is to me. I think if you look at it in progression of the 180, 180g, 270 and 300 and then 90 and 600 and now the 650. Everything Palm releases a new Treo it gets better and better so if you look at it that way, the next Treo is going to be wonderful , fantastic, and then think of the Treo after that. That's just my .02 or my humble opinion.
    My Cart
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    The only reason why Chuck Norris grows a beard is because he is trying to compete with Bruce Campbell's chin, which can break diamonds.
  19. #59  
    True. My Treo almost never crashes, but I don't see the point in constantly posting about that the way people post about problems.
  20. #60  
    Quote Originally Posted by Merlyn_3D
    Palm
    Hopefully without openning up any potential old wounds, did they tell you when you could have it back? Hint, Hint. . . .
    Last edited by gtwo; 03/06/2006 at 03:44 PM.
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