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  1.    #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by nickp
    A very interesting post. A lot of well thought and articulated messages.
    My 8700 BB is quite a step up from the previous models I have owned. As an email tool it is the best. But the main reason I keep going back to the T650 is it's form factor, reliability and ease of use

    Later ...

    That highlighted word is what has been holding me to the Treo's, for last 5 years . Trust me for a majority of people even ,this doesnot matter unless they have used this phone for at least 6 months . All they want to do is to, use phone and email . I think BB's do that well . The keyboard is very convinient and so is the screen .
    I show my colleaguesat work , all sorts of things the Treo does , however they use there Treo's only for appointments , phone and contacts .
    I have tried messin up with few PPC's HP 6515 was the last disaster from T mobile. I got rid of it after a month of use and came back to Treo.
    However the form factor is no more unique to Treo's as new devices are coming up with the same , which have much more to offer than T650 or 700.
    Also the hardware upgrade is not going to be significant in the next model.
    I will compormise the five way button for a larger screen.
    Treo's days are numbered."Some unknown device will kill it soon ".
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtreosexual
    That highlighted word is what has been holding me to the Treo's, for last 5 years . Trust me for a majority of people even ,this doesnot matter unless they have used this phone for at least 6 months . All they want to do is to, use phone and email . I think BB's do that well . The keyboard is very convinient and so is the screen .
    I show my colleaguesat work , all sorts of things the Treo does , however they use there Treo's only for appointments , phone and contacts .
    I have tried messin up with few PPC's HP 6515 was the last disaster from T mobile. I got rid of it after a month of use and came back to Treo.
    However the form factor is no more unique to Treo's as new devices are coming up with the same , which have much more to offer than T650 or 700.
    Also the hardware upgrade is not going to be significant in the next model.
    I will compormise the five way button for a larger screen.
    When the PC first came out, all people wanted to do on them were word processing and spreadsheet. Look at what a PC can do today.
  3. #23  
    Good pont related to this discussion in Palm's satement on the BB settlemment Friday"

    "We have long believed that a settlement between these parties would be the eventual outcome. We have remained focused on competing in the market by delivering choice to our customers based upon open, standards-based products that win in the marketplace. Palm's partnerships with Good Technology and Microsoft are attracting a growing number of customers. In the United States, we are gaining share of the smartphone market faster than any other supplier, including RIM. We think our momentum will continue as more and more companies understand and deploy our solutions."
  4.    #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    Good pont related to this discussion in Palm's satement on the BB settlemment Friday"

    "We have long believed that a settlement between these parties would be the eventual outcome. We have remained focused on competing in the market by delivering choice to our customers based upon open, standards-based products that win in the marketplace. Palm's partnerships with Good Technology and Microsoft are attracting a growing number of customers. In the United States, we are gaining share of the smartphone market faster than any other supplier, including RIM. We think our momentum will continue as more and more companies understand and deploy our solutions."

    Yeah , probably Billy boy( gates ), is helping them out in this.
    A canadian based company is no competition for him.
    Palm would never say so , offcourse they were getting the subscribers when RIMM was in court and uncertain about there future. After teh settlement , RIMM shares are up and palm's shares are down.
    Also this seems more like a statement for shareholder's stake than real staastics.
    Remember RIMM is not going to sit idle and will also come out with new devices and software upgrades. It is not easy to break a big subscription like that.
    Micorsoft and Apple are two examples.
    Treo's days are numbered."Some unknown device will kill it soon ".
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    Good pont related to this discussion in Palm's satement on the BB settlemment Friday"

    "We have long believed that a settlement between these parties would be the eventual outcome. We have remained focused on competing in the market by delivering choice to our customers based upon open, standards-based products that win in the marketplace. Palm's partnerships with Good Technology and Microsoft are attracting a growing number of customers. In the United States, we are gaining share of the smartphone market faster than any other supplier, including RIM. We think our momentum will continue as more and more companies understand and deploy our solutions."

    So in reality it's Palm, Microsoft, and Good Link VS Rim. It almost doesn't seem like a fair battle.

    With waiting till the 11th hour to settle, the damage is already done.
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    OK lets look at some what the marketing / finance peeps call "indicators":

    -First let's do some math.....Palm actually sold 1.95 million Treos last year and 2.77 million other handhelds at total of 4.72 million units....that's 10% more than RIM did.

    -Palm recently took in a some cash from selling off PalmSource, BB spent a crapload of moola on legal fees and 613 million in a settlement. That equates to a loss = $145 per unit sold !

    -How many sales did they lose in the last 2 months....short term cash holdings can't be strong.

    -Branddimensions completed their brand loyalty study and just reported that Treo users are far more satisfied with their devices than BB users are.

    -Palm just launched an enormously successful Windows Mobile device.

    -HP has decided to stop developing product for the BB market and is focusing solely on "convergence" do it all devices.

    -Frost & Sullivan completes study that ays ROI on a Treo exceeds $11k

    -BB Connect in final testing for Windows and Palm platforms.

    - While "on hold" waiting for RIM / NTP case, many businesses looked at BB alternatives and found Treo offered better solution.

    -88,000 corporations now call themselves Palm customers.

    -BB made its name on push e-mail and synch with MS Exchange servers....they were the only ones who could do it. What advantanges does a BB have any more ? Everyone has push, everyone has BB connect, everyone can sync w/ MS exchange servers....they have nothing anymore that makes them stand out.
    Shhh. You're making the troll look like it has no clue what it's talking about.
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtreosexual
    Link not working .
    Here is the new link .
    Reuters softened the title in the new version.
    http://today.reuters.com/news/articl...PALM-STOCK.xml
    This article looks to me more of a "Let's revive the CrackBerry... more than anything"

    Al
  8. #28  
    The truth is, almost no one that frequents this and other similar forums are going to select a BB over a Treo. For us "power" users, the limitations of the BB are too much. But from an enterprise IT standpoint, I am VERY happy with the BB, we have 2 BES servers, about to add a third and an attachment server and none of our users ever complain about their devices except when its down, which is infrequently.

    Email is the primary functionality (by a large margin) that the users are concerned about and the BB has that in spades.
  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtreosexual
    Yeah , probably Billy boy( gates ), is helping them out in this.
    That's alwas been MS strategy.....they have never "developed" anything in house, unless you consider MS Bob. If they can't buy, they copy...if they can't copy they subsidize the product via billions from other sectors driving competitors out of business.

    Remember RIMM is not going to sit idle and will also come out with new devices and software upgrades.
    Exactly, they are already making smartphones (not selling very many though) and next step will be complete Treo Clones. BB took the marketplace thru preschool with the BB and now, to my mind anyway, more and more are eager for a more capable device.
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by jw68
    But from an enterprise IT standpoint, I am VERY happy with the BB, we have 2 BES servers, about to add a third and an attachment server and none of our users ever complain about their devices except when its down, which is infrequently. Email is the primary functionality (by a large margin) that the users are concerned about and the BB has that in spades.
    I think BB will be seen as having a huge impact on the adoption of smartphone devices which analysts expect to double in sales this year. I think both IT departments and technophobes feared or were baffled by such devices and the BB was a nice "baby step" to bring them into the modern world of connectivity.

    Seeing how this bit of technology has improved their work flow, most are anxious to pursue the same line and obtain greater productivity via expanded capabilities. Unless BB makes Treo clone to serve as an upgrade path, where else can they go but to Treo, HP or other multi function device ?

    BB's key sale point tho was IT endorsement and as long as exchange synch is there for the IT dudes, they gonna be supportive.
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtreosexual
    http://today.reuters.com/news/articl...ocksNews&story
    id=2006-03-04T013811Z_01_N03248623_RTRUKOC_0_US-PALM-STOCK.xml

    So thank you palm ,keep the news about 700 P release secret for as much long as you can .
    It definitely is not helping you.
    If there was a timely planned 700P release, during blackberry and NTP legal mess. Palm stocks would have been way up by now.
    Management at palm definitely needs some thinking people.
    With all the new competing devices , palm looks more and more like a sinking ship and a company without great future stratgey for growth.
    Sorry to disappoint you metro, but if you look at stocks for last few weeks, and specially last 3 days, Palm stocks splitted and then day before yesterday it went up all the way to $42. Also common sense is not common now a days. If you do your homework you will find that Palm got future plan which include different flavors of Treo this year, including two OS. And I am happy that Palm didnt have to steal someone else's technology and have to pay anyone. BB got only email service that gives them edge. Wait for competition to catchup. And if Palm did release BB on Treo700p and for Treo650, I dont see many people buying BB phones. I do lot more than just checking my email. I am litening JAzz music on my Treo650 Live online using my Plantronics P590A bluetooth stereo headset (look ma' no wires) and Goodlink just delievered an email (although its a spam). Try that on a BB.
    I think Palm future is bright. And two OS make it brighter
    Technological superiority has never won a product battle. If that were the case we would all be flying in supersonic Concordes and using Apple computers.

    The key to winning the battle is a combination of price, convenience, marketing, sound business model and a bit of luck.
  12.    #32  
    Unfortunately most busy people are not concerned about listening to Jazz on there handheld.They are happy with the email functionality.Otherwise the motorola itunes would be stealing buisness from them.
    Treo's keyboards are painful and the screen to small. These are things which matter to people than the Jazz music.
    Treo's days are numbered."Some unknown device will kill it soon ".
  13.    #33  
    BTW, Smartphones will eventually die within next 5-10 years. The wave of the future is going to be devices like dualcore and alikes.Small tablet pc's with large HD with built in phone.
    Treo's days are numbered."Some unknown device will kill it soon ".
  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtreosexual
    BTW, Smartphones will eventually die within next 5-10 years. The wave of the future is going to be devices like dualcore and alikes.Small tablet pc's with large HD with built in phone.
    Never understood trolls...
  15. #35  
    I still agree with the OP to some degree. I think the next 2 years will determine just how good Palm really is. They have so much competition now. The Treo IS the one to beat BB, but to get the rest of the smartphone market, they have to quit with their tiny updates.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  16. #36  
    Mtreosexual... what happened to you?
    "'Form follows function' that has been misunderstood. Form and function should be one, joined in a spiritual union."
    Frank Lloyd Wright
  17.    #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by samkim
    Never understood trolls...
    You need to read about Trolls . I am not sure you understand it very well

    This thread was started by me . I would n't want to be disruptive and i have not been offensive either( Wikipedia definition) .

    Here is a little wikipedia explanantion for you .
    "The term troll is highly subjective. Some readers may characterize a post as trolling, while others may regard the same post as a legitimate contribution to the discussion, even if controversial. The term is often used to discredit an opposing position, or its proponent, by argument ad hominem. Likewise, calling someone a troll makes assumptions about a writer's motives that may be incorrect".
    Last edited by Mtreosexual; 03/04/2006 at 08:10 PM.
    Treo's days are numbered."Some unknown device will kill it soon ".
  18.    #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Hair
    Mtreosexual... what happened to you?
    This has been a hectic on call weekend , therefore these, patchy posts from my Treo.
    Last edited by Mtreosexual; 03/04/2006 at 08:09 PM.
    Treo's days are numbered."Some unknown device will kill it soon ".
  19.    #39  
    Here , here

    CNET

    http://news.com.com/Palm+outlook+not...3-6046055.html

    What's good for Research in Motion may not be good for Palm, which could end up selling fewer smart phones now that its rival has settled a dispute that threatened the future of its BlackBerry devices.

    Shares of Palm slumped nearly 4 percent while BlackBerry maker Research in Motion picked up as much as 19 percent in extended trade after RIM announced it had put an end to a four-year-old dispute by agreeing to pay patent holding firm NTP $612.5 million.

    Palm, based in Sunnyvale, California, had picked up customers at the expense of Canada's RIM, which was tied up in patent litigation that could have shut down the BlackBerry e-mail service in the United States, analysts said.

    For Palm, "the likely outcome is that opportunistic sales that they could have had with a shutdown, they are not going to have," said Ben Bollin, an analyst at FTN Midwest Securities in Cleveland who has a "neutral" rating on Palm and "buy" on RIM.
    Treo's days are numbered."Some unknown device will kill it soon ".
  20.    #40  
    Jacknaylor 's financial indicators are not indicating a financial gain for palm on wall street .
    RIM 's stock are going up after loosing almost there one quarter profit in lawsuit .

    It is not easy to switch customers from BB to Treo as you guys are saying .
    It will cost more than 800 dollars for one person according to this article in PC magzine ,unless palm is ready to sell there Treo's for 100 bucks .

    http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,1933133,00.asp

    How many corporations will be willing to take the risks and uncertainties of a new device along with the money involved?
    Treo's days are numbered."Some unknown device will kill it soon ".
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