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  1.    #1  
    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/03...ne_risk_study/

    "The researchers found that on average one to four cell phone calls were made during commercial flights in the north-east US. Some of these calls are made during critical flight stages such as the climb after take-off, or on final approach, potentially placing an aircraft in danger.

    The study focused mainly on in-flight mobile use but it also unearthed evidence that the use of devices such as laptops and DVD players, especially during critical flight stages, were also a potential hazard.

    "We found that the risk posed by these portable devices is higher than previously believed," said Bill Strauss, an expert in aircraft electromagnetic compatibility at the Naval Air Warfare Center in Patuxent River, Maryland, and a recent doctoral graduate from Carnegie Mellon.

    "These devices can disrupt normal operation of key cockpit instruments, especially Global Positioning System (GPS) receivers, which are increasingly vital for safe landings."

    The study comes as the US Federal Communications Commission is considering lifting the ban on the use of mobile phones during flights. Granger Morgan, head of the EPP Department at Carnegie Mellon, reckons this is a bad move.

    "We feel that passenger use of portable electronic devices on aircraft should continue to be limited for the safety of all concerned," said Morgan."
  2. #2  
    No Treos, No Laptops, No Ipods . . . . .

    I saw the condensed title in the main discussion page index and thought Jack was talking about a version of hell for techno-geeks. I was scared.


    Thank goodness the article was only about planes.
    Last edited by gtwo; 03/02/2006 at 04:08 PM.
  3.    #3  
    They have had two studies done and both recommending the opposite .... FCC saying cell phones no worse than other devices so should we remove ban ... now this saying cell phones should be banned but this other stuff is just as bad.
  4. #4  
    When it comes to air traffic safety I'm more apt to trust studies by the FAA than those by the FCC.
    ---
    iPhone / Samsung Epix

    Current playtoys:
    Also: Treo 750 (Test phone) / Sony Ericcson w900 (unlocked for international travel)
  5. #5  
    I believe it's a conspiracy initiated by Verizon to keep their sky phones on planes.
  6. #6  
    No problems here using either once the OK is given. I've been questioned a few times while using my Treo but showing them that it is flight mode solved that. I have seen others complain of being asked to turn them off. I guess it depends on the airline, I use Continental exclusively.
  7.    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by driven01
    When it comes to air traffic safety I'm more apt to trust studies by the FAA than those by the FCC.
    They don't do studies...they both pay the same peeps to do them and both concluded the same thing.....that cell phones as well as ipods, laptops etc all give off radiation that can critically affect flight instruments.

    Personally, I'd support the ban even if they didn't.....tho i would support wireless data usage once the fasten seat belt sign was off. 90% of the public feels the same way:

    "The ban on mobile phones on airplanes may soon be lifted, but most people are opposed to their use in-flight for voice calls. That's according to a worldwide survey by IDC which indicated that far from supporting a lifting of the ban by the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) in the US, a number of consumer groups claim the use of mobile phones on board airplanes would disturb passengers. Only 11 per cent of the 50,000 respondents would support the use of mobile phones for voice calls while on board an airplane."
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by Big Calhoun
    No problems here using either once the OK is given. I've been questioned a few times while using my Treo but showing them that it is flight mode solved that. I have seen others complain of being asked to turn them off. I guess it depends on the airline, I use Continental exclusively.

    I haven't run into any problems on Delta either and I'm usually in first class where it can be seen. I think any FA that gives you grief doesn't know you can turn the radio off on PDA phones and Blackberries.
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    They don't do studies...they both pay the same peeps to do them and both concluded the same thing.....that cell phones as well as ipods, laptops etc all give off radiation that can critically affect flight instruments.

    Personally, I'd support the ban even if they didn't.....tho i would support wireless data usage once the fasten seat belt sign was off. 90% of the public feels the same way:

    "The ban on mobile phones on airplanes may soon be lifted, but most people are opposed to their use in-flight for voice calls. That's according to a worldwide survey by IDC which indicated that far from supporting a lifting of the ban by the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) in the US, a number of consumer groups claim the use of mobile phones on board airplanes would disturb passengers. Only 11 per cent of the 50,000 respondents would support the use of mobile phones for voice calls while on board an airplane."
    Agreed. The last thing I want or need on a 4 hour flight is to be trapped in a soup can with 50 people who just can't wait to tell someone the results of their latest medical exams.

    There wouldn't be enough liquor in the cart.
    I'm back!
  10. #10  
    I wouldnt mind them lifting the ban for cellphones... as long as the only transmission your allowed to do on the phone is data.

    I don't want someone talking on their phone for hours on end (which im sure some would do on flights) a few minutes doesn't bother me. But people who sit there and email or whatever, that I really don't have any problem with... the clicking of keys would most likely be hidden by the engine noise anyway.
  11. #11  
    All they really need to do is make sure people have stuff turned OFF during critical times. I'd hate to see a ban on laptops and iPods. Cell phones(except for data), I can understand and I agree with some here. I don't like hearing other people's calls either.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  12. finnd's Avatar
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    #12  
    if an average of one to four calls is made during the 'critical time' and it is so dangerous, why aren't planes dropping out of the sky?
    Dan Finn
    Verizon 700wx
  13. #13  
    I never bought this line from the airlines. Seriously, if electronic devices were so dangerous, why allow them onboard in the first place?
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

    Remember: "Anyone that thinks the Treo should just work right out of the box, shouldn't own a Treo..."
  14.    #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    I never bought this line from the airlines. Seriously, if electronic devices were so dangerous, why allow them onboard in the first place?
    Imagine.....12 Saudi's with Sprint Theft Deterrent System....there goes the Freedom Tower ! I expect Cheney will be at my door with his shotgun this after noon after bthey "spied" this post
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    Imagine.....12 Saudi's with Sprint Theft Deterrent System....there goes the Freedom Tower ! I expect Cheney will be at my door with his shotgun this after noon after bthey "spied" this post
    Beware of ECHELON.

    But back on topic, imagine a group of hijackers;

    "Stand back. You will fly us to Pakistan, or else....we make phone calls!"

    (Psycho shower scene music plays in background)

    "I'm warning you, I have an iPod, and I'm willing to use it!!"
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

    Remember: "Anyone that thinks the Treo should just work right out of the box, shouldn't own a Treo..."
  16.    #16  
    Well I think the danger is like it is in hospitals, I referred to a study done in hospitals where they found that if you stood right next to a respirator and then sent a call out, the respirator would turn off. Stand a certain amount of feet away and you are fine. The tickler then is someone having to pick the "safe number" and no one is gonna ever want to do that.

    So the guy in the tail or on the wing sneaks a call or someone from the crapper and the signal won't effect the instruments. But the dude in first class right next to the cockpit door......maybe.
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    I never bought this line from the airlines. Seriously, if electronic devices were so dangerous, why allow them onboard in the first place?
    I'm relatively new to the forum, but this is a topic that I'm knowledgeable in, and so I couldn't resist chiming in!!!

    The airlines don't make the rules regarding the use of portable electronic devices (PEDs) - the FAA does. Chapter 14 of The Code of Federal Regulations, Part 91.21 , governs the use (or lack thereof) of portable electronic devices aboard aircraft on IFR flight plans (which all airline flights operate on).

    As a pilot, I can tell you that MANY PEDs can create interference with navigation systems. Have you ever noticed a sound in the car stereo when your cell phone rings? Or noticed a sound in your PC speakers if your phone is nearby?

    There are several systems in an aircraft which can be affected by even the slightest transmission. finnd made a comment, and begged the question about planes falling out of the sky. Well, I assure you that navigation signals aren't keeping the planes in the air, the wings are. However, the navigation systems ARE keeping the aircraft on course. Believe me, you don't want that airplane to be off by 10 degrees in the heading while departing from an airport with simultaneous departures from close parallel runways. You don't want the aircraft to be even slightly off course when making an instrument approach in low visability and low clouds, 500 feet above the ground, with no outside reference. These aren't good times to even risk electronic interference.

    According to 14 CFR 91.21 (c), it's up to the operator of an aircraft (in the case of an airline, the company) to determine if a device can safely be used aboard an aircraft in flight. Since there are literally hundreds of cell phone models and types, it would be almost impossible for an operator to determine the whether or not devices could be used. So, they ban all of them. Just like AM/FM receivers, and just like walkie-talkies. Handheld GPS units? Well, there aren't near as many models, and it's also a system designed to be used with aircraft. So, the risk is more acceptable. Even with that equipment, it's still banned during critical phases of flight (during take-off and landing, during approach to landing, and below 10,000 feet).

    Sorry the post was so long - didn't mean to ramble!!
  18. #18  
    I recall the crew of a plane I was flying getting all lathered up when I pulled out my old Apple Newton and started writing faxes and email for later. No wireless stuff at all on the old Newton. But they were not taking any chances and begged me to turn it off. Later they all wanted to see it in action though.
  19. #19  
    There so dangerous, and yet they allow them onboard.
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

    Remember: "Anyone that thinks the Treo should just work right out of the box, shouldn't own a Treo..."
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    There so dangerous, and yet they allow them onboard.
    They're no more dangerous than an ink pen - but an ink pen, in the wrong place, can bring a jet down.


    It's possible for somebody to deploy the emergency slide at an exit door on the ground (assuming that the cabin hasn't pressurized yet), and this can be extremely dangerous, yet they allow people to sit in emergency exits.

    The airlines are simply assuming that as adults, we can all be trusted to follow the law and not use the devices in flight, where they might cause interference with navigation systems.

    Would you be more comfortable using your Treo, knowing that there's a pretty good chance that the signal is causing a disruption in the navigation of the aircraft?
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