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  1. #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tim_treo
    "I could give a crap about Wi-Fi. The phone on the Treo sucks."

    I hear you. I started a thread about this a few days back. I think the consensus was that wifi is only worth a crap for people who can't afford good data plans or are in markets which don't have good coverage. Since decent data plans are only getting cheaper, more widespread, and faster, wifi is backward looking instead of forward.

    I vote for more memory and a better browser. Palm OS is out of date too, so if I go treo again, it will be with Windows.
    Man, why don't people get it?!?!?! WiFi has many uses besides what you've listed. Maybe it's because the only idea of WiFi anyone has around here is simply to surf the web. Come on guys, use your head for something besides holding your phone up to.


    Ever try to browse your companies firewall protected LAN via your cell provider's data connection? Unless you're in tight w/ the Net Admins, you probably won't get far and if you do get in, it won't be very fast. Just one of many examples.
    Palm III -> Palm Vx -> Clie T615c -> Clie T665c -> Tungsten T|3 -> Treo 650 -> Trew 700W (for a few days) -> XV6700 -> Moto Q
    http://geckotek.blogspot.com
  2. #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tim_treo
    "Plus, once entire cities are blanketed with wi-fi, wi-fi is very forward looking."

    Right. Like they are really going to blanket a entire city like, say, Kansas City with WiFi. (Yeah, I know about the Baltimore Inner Harbor and Google's plan for San Francisco. These are rather isolated cases.) You have any clue how many hotspots that would require to extend even moderately out into the burbs in a typical Midwest City? And don't forget about the highways outwards. You just keep holding your breath for this to happen, ok? And let's not even talk about the battery drain. A Treo with a 8 hour standby time with the WiFi on? That's really useful.

    WiFi is great for your house and office. It sure beats running wires to your desktop or laptop. But it is horrible for device whose sine qua non lies in its connectivity, anywhere, anytime, all the time.

    In a few years, I see WiFi on cell phones only useful for the interior of building where cell reception doesn't reach.

    We're not talking the same WiFi access point you use in your house or T-Mobile puts in a Starbucks. Read up a little.
    Palm III -> Palm Vx -> Clie T615c -> Clie T665c -> Tungsten T|3 -> Treo 650 -> Trew 700W (for a few days) -> XV6700 -> Moto Q
    http://geckotek.blogspot.com
  3. #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tim_treo
    "I could give a crap about Wi-Fi. The phone on the Treo sucks."

    I hear you. I started a thread about this a few days back. I think the consensus was that wifi is only worth a crap for people who can't afford good data plans or are in markets which don't have good coverage. Since decent data plans are only getting cheaper, more widespread, and faster, wifi is backward looking instead of forward.

    I vote for more memory and a better browser. Palm OS is out of date too, so if I go treo again, it will be with Windows.
    How about those who DON'T WANT EXPENSIVE PROPRIETARY DATA PLANS BECAUSE WE DON'T NEED THEM, but do need to be connected away from the desktop SOMETIMES?! Enough with the wi-fi hatred!! And explain why many new models of PDAs have built-in wi-fi? They're NOT looking backward, they realize it's a necessity! They realize people want freedom!
    Last edited by The Phone Diva; 12/22/2005 at 01:56 AM.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  4. #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tim_treo
    "Plus, once entire cities are blanketed with wi-fi, wi-fi is very forward looking."

    Right. Like they are really going to blanket a entire city like, say, Kansas City with WiFi. (Yeah, I know about the Baltimore Inner Harbor and Google's plan for San Francisco. These are rather isolated cases.) You have any clue how many hotspots that would require to extend even moderately out into the burbs in a typical Midwest City? And don't forget about the highways outwards. You just keep holding your breath for this to happen, ok? And let's not even talk about the battery drain. A Treo with a 8 hour standby time with the WiFi on? That's really useful.
    WiFi is great for your house and office. It sure beats running wires to your desktop or laptop. But it is horrible for device whose sine qua non lies in its connectivity, anywhere, anytime, all the time.

    In a few years, I see WiFi on cell phones only useful for the interior of building where cell reception doesn't reach.
    Maybe it's just me, but I wouldn't be on wi-fi for 8 hours.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  5. #45  
    I'm still wondering what the heck a "low-end" Treo is. Will it be better than my 600? If not, how much can they charge for it when you'll be able to get leftover 600's inexpensively? If it is better than my 600, how will it compare to the 650 and what will the pricing be relative to that model? I just think this Lowrider think is either going to be undercut by the 600/650 or is going deflate the prices of higher end models. Palm is going to have a price war with itself.
    ROOTING for WebOS makes me more sympathetic to Cubs fans.
  6. #46  
    I agree with the WIFI analysis in that as EVDO decreases in price, WIFI will become meaningless in most situations. I'd rather have a fast more functionl browser that can support XML feeds than WIFI. So many sites are using this now that my Treo is becoming less and less useful for web browsing.
    ROOTING for WebOS makes me more sympathetic to Cubs fans.
  7. Iceman6's Avatar
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    #47  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tim_treo
    "Plus, once entire cities are blanketed with wi-fi, wi-fi is very forward looking."

    Right. Like they are really going to blanket a entire city like, say, Kansas City with WiFi. (Yeah, I know about the Baltimore Inner Harbor and Google's plan for San Francisco. These are rather isolated cases.) You have any clue how many hotspots that would require to extend even moderately out into the burbs in a typical Midwest City? And don't forget about the highways outwards. You just keep holding your breath for this to happen, ok? And let's not even talk about the battery drain. A Treo with a 8 hour standby time with the WiFi on? That's really useful.

    WiFi is great for your house and office. It sure beats running wires to your desktop or laptop. But it is horrible for device whose sine qua non lies in its connectivity, anywhere, anytime, all the time.

    In a few years, I see WiFi on cell phones only useful for the interior of building where cell reception doesn't reach.
    Isolated, my ***. The city of Minneapolis is down to two finalists for a citywide wifi network. IMO the entire Twin Cities metro will go wifi by the end of the decade. This is a trend, baby. One of the two contenders is proposing a WiMax backbone with WiFi hotspots.
  8. #48  
    I just hope and pray that 1) the new units will be clamshell or swing out keyboard and 2) anything they do on the Win side they will back up and do the same or better on the Palm OS side. Seems to me they could manufacture both OS units in the same factory just different lines.
    ONE can be spelled as NEO.
    There is no spoon.
  9. #49  
    Has anyone seen any renderings of either the "Hollywood" or the "Low Rider"?
    ONE can be spelled as NEO.
    There is no spoon.
  10. #50  
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob-C
    I'm still wondering what the heck a "low-end" Treo is. Will it be better than my 600? If not, how much can they charge for it when you'll be able to get leftover 600's inexpensively? If it is better than my 600, how will it compare to the 650 and what will the pricing be relative to that model? I just think this Lowrider think is either going to be undercut by the 600/650 or is going deflate the prices of higher end models. Palm is going to have a price war with itself.
    I have the feeling the low end Treo will be the similar form factor of the Treo line up so far, with Zire 31 specs. Idk if it would have the new connector though, i could see this Treo having a mini USB port for data and charging. They'll have the camera and a SD slot, but no hi-res screen or BT.

    Timmay
    Iím a lucky man to count on both hands
    The ones I love..

    Visor Pro -> Visor Edge -> Treo 180 -> Treo 270 -> Treo 600 -> Treo 650 -> T|T2+SE T68i -> Treo 600 -> T-Mobile MDA -> Treo 755p -> Treo 800w -> Treo 755p -> PALM PRE -> Palm Pre 2 -> HP Palm Pre 3

    Twittering about
  11. #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob-C
    I agree with the WIFI analysis in that as EVDO decreases in price, WIFI will become meaningless in most situations. I'd rather have a fast more functionl browser that can support XML feeds than WIFI. So many sites are using this now that my Treo is becoming less and less useful for web browsing.
    Do you people not understand how networks work? Why do I want to be on Sprint's network when I'm trying to browse my own local network??!?!!?!?!

    What the heck does the browser and XML feeds have to do with WiFi?!?!?!?!

    Can we get some networking education for these people?
    Palm III -> Palm Vx -> Clie T615c -> Clie T665c -> Tungsten T|3 -> Treo 650 -> Trew 700W (for a few days) -> XV6700 -> Moto Q
    http://geckotek.blogspot.com
  12. Reapman's Avatar
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    #52  
    I agree with the WIFI analysis in that as EVDO decreases in price, WIFI will become meaningless in most situations. I'd rather have a fast more functionl browser that can support XML feeds than WIFI. So many sites are using this now that my Treo is becoming less and less useful for web browsing.
    Perhaps an example of these "decreases in price" is in order...
    http://www.bell.ca/shop/en_CA_AB/P30.details

    Yeah, your right... why would I want free WiFi where its available, when I can pay $60 a month for slower speeds? (btw, that's $60 for just the data. no voice) How foolish of me. Try and remember that just because you can get cheap EVDO, doesn't mean the entire world can. Or even all of North America. And like the poster said before me, your comparing apples and oranges... The folks building the Palm web browser are not the same folks designing the circuitry...

    Treo 700p, with no WiFi support (I'd be happy with even SD CARD support!) = loss of customers. Simple. Their competitor has it.
  13. Tim_treo's Avatar
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    #53  
    I don't hate Wifi. Some of my best friends use Wifi, and I even use Wifi half the time. Wifi has done a lot for this country! I think one just needs to be smart about technology, and have usefulness and unobtrusiveness as the mantra, not coolness.

    Many keep thinking of their Treo as a little laptop. It's not, it's something different. It's a pocketable device whose main utility lies in its portability and transparent, effortless connectivity, be that voice or data, in all places. There's no bothersome search and configuration for each hotspot that one happens across, just a simple push of a button and instant access.

    If you think about things in the the traditional way, you'll keep coming up with screwy ideas, like using a cell phone to access your home or office network via wifi. Why in the world would 99% of people want to access their home network on a 2" screen? I DID network my old PDA to my home network with Wifi. It was a waste of time. In the end, I found it far less aggravating just to walk over to my laptop or desktop. No, the value of devices like the Treo lies elsewhere for the vast majority of us, and the value is being able to provide instant access anywhere, at the mall, on the highway, on vacation, in the car, without having to worry about battery life, or setting up an account and password for each and every hotspot one happens across.

    The Minneapolis and Philadelphia examples are just silly. Never mind the interference issues and legal resistance from other data providers - these would only work in the city center; as soon as one drove ten miles from downtown you'd be out of luck. And if people really wanted to blanket a 900 square mile area (30 miles by 30 miles, about the minimum for a decent sized metro area) this will take AT LEAST 5 years, where many cell data coverage plans already have that TODAY in many metro areas. Five years from now, cell data plans will be cheaper, faster and more widespread. Backward looking indeed.

    Be smart about technology. View gadgets through the lens of usefulness and not coolness. Push cell companies to offer data packages at reasonable rates. Sprint has to be making a killing off it's $15/mos data plans, right? More companies will follow because that is where the money lies.
  14. #54  
    Quote Originally Posted by Geckotek
    Do you people not understand how networks work? Why do I want to be on Sprint's network when I'm trying to browse my own local network??!?!!?!?!

    What the heck does the browser and XML feeds have to do with WiFi?!?!?!?!

    Can we get some networking education for these people?
    One of these days we'll get it. I think most people are indeed thinking of web browsing only with mention of wi-fi. The 802.11b/g Wireless LAN part should clue us in that it's about wireless local area networks but I guess we're not thinking about that too often. Me included, sad to say.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  15. #55  
    Wifi is for work places, homes, malls, and other small areas that have the need for wifi.

    The future of Really Wide are networks is WiMax. Three towers will cover Seattle, WA in testing that has already begun. If palm takes this path and builds in WiMax that would be a huge step in the right direction. The IEEE already set a standard for the WiMax, 802.16 if i'm not mistaken.

    You want wifi? buy a sled or supported SD card.

    Timmay
    Iím a lucky man to count on both hands
    The ones I love..

    Visor Pro -> Visor Edge -> Treo 180 -> Treo 270 -> Treo 600 -> Treo 650 -> T|T2+SE T68i -> Treo 600 -> T-Mobile MDA -> Treo 755p -> Treo 800w -> Treo 755p -> PALM PRE -> Palm Pre 2 -> HP Palm Pre 3

    Twittering about
  16. Reapman's Avatar
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    #56  
    (last post on this, don't want to hijack this thread anymore then I already have)
    You want wifi? buy a sled or supported SD card.
    Won't even discuss the sled (seems unreasonable I'd have to do that when WM5.0 devices do not), but if you can give me the URL for a supported SD Card, please do, to me that'd be good enough to keep me going.

    edit: Sorry had to throw this in:
    Be smart about technology. View gadgets through the lens of usefulness and not coolness. Push cell companies to offer data packages at reasonable rates.
    So for those of us going overseas, and CDMA and GSM are not an option, Palm should be willing to accept us as losses to the WM5.0 side huh? Sorry, guess I'm just not very smart for wanting a device that does what I need. My bad.
    Last edited by Reapman; 12/22/2005 at 04:55 PM.
  17. #57  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tim_treo
    I don't hate Wifi. Some of my best friends use Wifi, and I even use Wifi half the time. Wifi has done a lot for this country! I think one just needs to be smart about technology, and have usefulness and unobtrusiveness as the mantra, not coolness.

    1. Many keep thinking of their Treo as a little laptop. It's not, it's something different. It's a pocketable device whose main utility lies in its portability and transparent, effortless connectivity, be that voice or data, in all places. There's no bothersome search and configuration for each hotspot that one happens across, just a simple push of a button and instant access.

    If you think about things in the the traditional way, you'll keep coming up with screwy ideas, like using a cell phone to access your home or office network via wifi. 2. Why in the world would 99% of people want to access their home network on a 2" screen? I DID network my old PDA to my home network with Wifi. It was a waste of time. In the end, I found it far less aggravating just to walk over to my laptop or desktop. 3. No, the value of devices like the Treo lies elsewhere for the vast majority of us, and the value is being able to provide instant access anywhere, at the mall, on the highway, on vacation, in the car, without having to worry about battery life, or setting up an account and password for each and every hotspot one happens across.

    The Minneapolis and Philadelphia examples are just silly. Never mind the interference issues and legal resistance from other data providers - these would only work in the city center; as soon as one drove ten miles from downtown you'd be out of luck. And if people really wanted to blanket a 900 square mile area (30 miles by 30 miles, about the minimum for a decent sized metro area) this will take AT LEAST 5 years, where many cell data coverage plans already have that TODAY in many metro areas. Five years from now, cell data plans will be cheaper, faster and more widespread. Backward looking indeed.

    Be smart about technology. View gadgets through the lens of usefulness and not coolness. Push cell companies to offer data packages at reasonable rates. 4. Sprint has to be making a killing off it's $15/mos data plans, right? More companies will follow because that is where the money lies.
    1. Yes, they do and what's wrong with that? That's what it's basically supposed to be(look at the features), a portable laptop replacement.
    2. Convenience, plain and simple.
    3. Maybe I'm alone in this but on vacation I DO NOT do emails! I'm also not going to browse or check email while in the car or on the highway, unless I pull over. But usually things can wait till I get to my destination. At the mall or out on errands, fine, but I don't always like instant access. We work too much in this country.
    4. Sprint and T-Mobile are the only carriers that have data rates good enough for a part-time data user like me. And even T-Mobile has sense enough to set up wi-fi service for those NOT with T-Mobile. Part of it may have to do with realizing people have a right to choice, not forced to go with their carriers data plan if they don't want to.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  18. #58  
    Quote Originally Posted by bigredgpk

    You want wifi? buy a sled or supported SD card.

    Timmay
    How about a WM5 device that has the foresight to have built-in wi-fi.? There are several. No need for the stupid sled or a card that takes up your SD slot.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  19. #59  
    [QUOTE=Reapman]Won't even discuss the sled (seems unreasonable I'd have to do that when WM5.0 devices do not), but if you can give me the URL for a supported SD Card, please do, to me that'd be good enough to keep me going.

    Wifi SD card will work on the Treo 700w.
    Iím a lucky man to count on both hands
    The ones I love..

    Visor Pro -> Visor Edge -> Treo 180 -> Treo 270 -> Treo 600 -> Treo 650 -> T|T2+SE T68i -> Treo 600 -> T-Mobile MDA -> Treo 755p -> Treo 800w -> Treo 755p -> PALM PRE -> Palm Pre 2 -> HP Palm Pre 3

    Twittering about
  20. Reapman's Avatar
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    #60  
    You are correct, I was more thinking of Palm OS and HW combo. But 700w means 240x240 res (as far as I know) and loosing a few hundred dollars worth of software i've invested in. If the 700p keeps the 320 res and still allows the WiFi SD Card I'm happy. If there is no 700p, or no WiFi available for it.... welllll....
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